Episode 41 from The Grit Theory. 

Today we sit down with Nick “Cuts” Cutsforth and have a good old fashioned genuine, intentional conversation. 

Highlights include: 
-Explore how the family unit benefits society first, not society the family. 
-Have a plan & know the desired end game. 
-Be adaptable. 
-Developing Deep Relationships
-Don’t forget your history. 
-Ownership of life choices. 
-Stick to your moral standing. 
-Seek wise & hard counsel.
-Learn yourself. 
-Feed the good, temper the bad. 
-Turtle talk.
-Always keep going. 

Did you find value in today’s conversation? SHARE IT! 

Also, check out Be Relentless: If the obstacle is the way, then we must be waymakers HERE.

Do you want to learn more? Check out:

The Book: Be Relentless: If the obstacle is the way, then we must be WayMakers.

The Podcast: “Be Relentless Podcast”

The Fuel: Sisu Stamina, Performance Evolved

Linktree: Here.

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Episode Transcript

 

08;06;30;21 – 08;06;29;23
Nick “Cuts” 
Hello. Good morning.

08;06;29;05 – 08;06;28;15
Jon
How are you?

08;06;27;22 – 08;06;26;26
Nick “Cuts”
I am.

08;06;26;15 – 08;06;23;01
Nick “Cuts” 
Doing well. The yeah, like I said.

08;06;23;01 – 08;06;22;16
Nick “Cuts”
The.

08;06;21;26 – 08;06;17;26
Nick “Cuts” 
Family is a little sick. They got the they got the cold, not the rona. Just a cold.

08;06;17;21 – 08;06;14;13
Jon
So do you know it’s actually it’s not the rona?

08;06;13;16 – 08;06;06;13
Nick “Cuts” 
I have a test in right now. I should know later today if I have the rona because we’ve had three cases and my unit.

08;06;06;13 – 08;06;05;19
Nick “Cuts”
Now, so.

08;06;05;07 – 08;06;02;19
Jon
So to be determined, it’s possible. It’s the rona.

08;06;02;13 – 08;05;52;11
Nick “Cuts” 
It’s one of my home tests. Yeah, I did one of the home tests and it came back negative. So I mean, same home test that was used and somebody tested a pineapple and it came back with COVID.

08;05;52;11 – 08;05;50;01
Lindsey
So we’ll see. Interesting.

08;05;47;20 – 08;05;42;16
Jon
So I was secretly hoping that you were going to surprise me and show up in person.

08;05;42;03 – 08;05;41;08
Nick “Cuts”
For us to talk.

08;05;41;00 – 08;05;39;09
Jon
Yeah, it didn’t happen.

08;05;39;00 – 08;05;37;24
Nick “Cuts” 
Sorry, that.

08;05;37;24 – 08;05;37;07
Lindsey
Crash.

08;05;36;11 – 08;05;33;15
Nick “Cuts”
It’s a bit of a drive. We all we all want to.

08;05;33;15 – 08;05;27;12
Nick “Cuts” 
But the what would be a only 15 or 16 hour drive to you guys would turn into at least a three day drive.

08;05;26;23 – 08;05;25;08
Lindsey
Yeah, we totally understand that.

08;05;25;01 – 08;05;22;27
Jon
15 hours is a lot, especially at the little one.

08;05;22;13 – 08;05;21;17
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

08;05;21;06 – 08;05;19;26
Jon
eight hours would be doable.

08;05;19;11 – 08;05;11;27
Lindsey
I mean, we just did a ten hour drive to Utah and it was twelve. I think we we kept it to twelve hours on the way back. I think it was more like 13, though.

08;05;11;03 – 08;05;09;24
Nick “Cuts” 
Yeah, that’s that’s right.

08;05;08;19 – 08;05;08;08
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

08;05;07;25 – 08;04;51;27
Nick “Cuts” 
That’s what it turned into when we went down to go see Lauren’s grandfather. It was a ten hour drive turned into a 14 hour drive. Within the span of 72 hours. So two, 14 hour. Yeah, it was an adventure, to.

08;04;51;27 – 08;04;46;24
Nick “Cuts”
Say the least. Yeah, we got that.

08;04;46;12 – 08;04;39;07
Nick “Cuts” 
There is the pull off at the gas stations for the for the feedings, the diaper changes. And yeah, it was.

08;04;39;07 – 08;04;38;22
Nick “Cuts”
It was good.

08;04;38;12 – 08;04;33;15
Nick “Cuts” 
It definitely eye-opening to be a parent. It is a.

08;04;33;14 – 08;04;32;28
Nick “Cuts”
No.

08;04;32;15 – 08;04;32;00
Lindsey
That’s true.

08;04;31;20 – 08;04;29;16
Jon
Yeah, yeah. Welcome to fatherhood, man.

08;04;29;03 – 08;04;06;03
Nick “Cuts” 
I know it is. It is the new frontier. You know, the the concept of like, I know what I’m physically capable of. I know what Lauren’s physically capable of. I know what we’re physically capable of as adults. And now you throw in a little while human whose sole purpose right now is to grow and can’t do that

08;04;06;03 – 08;04;01;01
Nick “Cuts” 
without either one of you supporting. It’s like. What do you do?

08;04;00;08 – 08;03;58;17
Lindsey
Yeah, they wreak havoc on all of it.

08;03;58;00 – 08;03;48;00
Nick “Cuts” 
All of it. All of it. It’s schedules, sleep schedules. You can’t technically get a sleep train till they’re three months old or even.

08;03;47;19 – 08;03;45;10
Lindsey
Recently, even if it works at three months.

08;03;44;10 – 08;03;36;29
Jon
So the science is just like black magic. People will just say things that sound good, but they don’t really. There’s no real science to this.

08;03;36;28 – 08;03;35;07
Nick “Cuts”
Roll the dice. Oh, we got a three.

08;03;35;07 – 08;03;34;00
Nick “Cuts” 
Day, we got three hours.

08;03;33;29 – 08;03;33;20
Nick “Cuts”
Yay.

08;03;33;01 – 08;03;22;29
Jon
Sydney. I’m curious with being a new dad, you’ve always been one. He’s been amazing with children and loved them. What has been the most surprising with it being your own kid?

08;03;21;25 – 08;03;19;29
Nick “Cuts”
It is been a.

08;03;18;15 – 08;02;58;01
Nick “Cuts” 
It’s like a it’s a paradigm shift like love, kids absolutely love hanging out with them. But there’s a point where you can give them back to the parents right here. You’re there for a short period, but there’s something about having your own child in the we call them his big gummy grins that you could have just changed

08;02;58;01 – 08;02;41;27
Nick “Cuts” 
the biggest diaper ever known to man and confetti have gone everywhere, and he’s happy as a clam afterwards, a big old grin, and it’s like it just goes away. There’s no animosity or they just put it’s like it happened.

08;02;41;12 – 08;02;33;21
Nick “Cuts” 
And now he’s smiling in his love. That’s his. It’s like it just washes over you and you’re just like, I love.

08;02;33;21 – 08;02;31;05
Nick “Cuts”
It. It’s it’s real.

08;02;30;15 – 08;02;17;00
Nick “Cuts” 
You know, it just it makes all the hard stuff, all the tough stuff going to the office, dealing with knuckleheads. They’re dealing with all the stupidity around quarter because you come home and you get that big old grin and it’s like Hank, have things better.

08;02;16;07 – 08;02;15;17
Jon
Become bigger in.

08;02;14;28 – 08;02;12;24
Nick “Cuts” 
The gummy grin. He has no teeth.

08;02;12;24 – 08;02;11;16
Lindsey
So yeah.

08;02;10;19 – 08;02;05;22
Jon
So the so the surprise for you is the connection with your own.

08;02;05;11 – 08;02;05;00
Nick “Cuts”
Mm hmm.

08;02;04;18 – 08;01;45;24
Nick “Cuts” 
And I think that that’s the pivotal and just as you evolve or as you grow in life having that connection, you know, because that’s that’s the very foundation of of being able to to go further, go farther than you can individually, even as a married couple.

08;01;45;08 – 08;01;24;25
Nick “Cuts” 
Your your Mac’s input into society as a whole caps out at a certain point. There’s only so much you as a married couple can provide the world and your legacy kind of tapers off at a certain point. Unless you have the next generation, you can raise up and push that forward with, you know.

08;01;23;22 – 08;01;16;07
Nick “Cuts” 
And so looking at him every day from the the lights that he sees and his eyes get like the size of.

08;01;15;25 – 08;01;15;14
Nick “Cuts”
You know.

08;01;15;00 – 08;00;59;23
Nick “Cuts” 
Saucer plates to him kicking and moving and being able to do all the coordination stuff. It’s like, this is him growing and being able to, once he’s older, be able to pass on some of the those skills and those things so he can go further than I did.

08;00;59;07 – 08;00;53;22
Nick “Cuts” 
You know, I got launched in here. I’m hoping to launch him in here in the next generations after that.

08;00;52;28 – 08;00;46;20
Lindsey
So absolutely. I found to you that it was like a new weight of responsibility to continue to carry forward.

08;00;45;21 – 08;00;31;11
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. And learn on a regular is just, I mean, she’s phenomenal with him and just the things he’s learned from her. It definitely drives in that point of like it is a it is a partnership to raise children.

08;00;31;11 – 08;00;16;11
Nick “Cuts” 
It’s not just a mom thing or a dad thing, it is a partnership to to drive that forward. And and that’s just the very foundation of society in general is the family unit. You know, that’s why God created Adam and Eve.

08;00;16;11 – 08;00;02;09
Nick “Cuts” 
The way he did and the way we we perceive reality is you need the balance of the two, you need the love and the nurture, but you need both sets to be able to push that forward. I’m not saying that single parents can’t do it.

08;00;02;09 – 09;59;59;25
Lindsey
It’s just it makes it more difficult.

09;59;59;15 – 09;59;58;21
Nick “Cuts”
Absolutely.

09;59;58;20 – 09;59;51;18
Jon
There are a significant deficit and deficit if you’re a single parent and and the data supports that. Yeah.

09;59;51;01 – 09;59;37;24
Lindsey
It’s not even to. I mean, single parents get put their house like I hold them in a lot of regard and things like that because it’s like, man, for a while. I mean, I had Jonathan, you know, while he was in the military and things like that.

09;59;37;24 – 09;59;26;07
Lindsey
But at the same time, it was like I single parented for all those years and it was like I was at least able to text him or reach out to him and have that extra support where it was a sole single parent.

09;59;26;07 – 09;59;18;06
Lindsey
You have to kind of look for that through family or friends, and it becomes really difficult. So I give them all the kudos. That’s hard.

09;59;18;05 – 09;59;10;14
Jon
I think the point that we’re saying is it’s not a criticism of being a single parent by any means because that’s that’s one hell of a journey. But it is something to protect.

09;59;10;12 – 09;59;05;27
Lindsey
Know what the proper family unit. Yeah. Yeah, it really matters.

09;59;05;18 – 09;59;04;28
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely.

09;59;04;15 – 09;58;55;22
Jon
It’s crazy because that’s actually a big part of the type of community we’re wanting to build with. All this right is is honoring and making sexy again.

09;58;54;20 – 09;58;53;22
Lindsey
The family in a.

09;58;53;22 – 09;58;41;00
Jon
Partnership of a husband and wife. It in life because it’s crazy, because even in a lot of people that do have whole homes like they’ll talk about the dad babysitting or whatever, it’s like, No, this is his father.

09;58;41;00 – 09;58;29;13
Jon
Like, he should be as equal part of this in his own way. You know, as a man, I will love, nurture my sons, my the flavor of that love and nurture will be different than how Lindsay loves and nurtures them.

09;58;29;00 – 09;58;18;07
Jon
But I have a responsibility to love and nurture them, just as I do to hold them accountable and have discipline. Does she and it’s that we are better at it together, for sure.

09;58;17;23 – 09;57;59;14
Nick “Cuts” 
Exactly because you balance each other’s. I don’t want to see inequities. More so your areas of lacking, right? So for me, you know, I I’m not the best speller for an example. I don’t know how I got through college.

09;57;59;14 – 09;57;46;27
Nick “Cuts” 
I don’t know how I’m getting through my papers with my masters. I spill about on the eighth grade level. Auto auto correct is my friend. And Lauren, on the other hand.

09;57;46;18 – 09;57;42;06
Lindsey
Can spell great words backwards, upside down and sideways.

09;57;41;27 – 09;57;39;29
Nick “Cuts”
You can see it from across the room.

09;57;39;28 – 09;57;38;18
Nick “Cuts” 
This millionaires in my paper.

09;57;38;05 – 09;57;37;22
Nick “Cuts”
It is.

09;57;36;23 – 09;57;22;10
Nick “Cuts” 
And it’s humbling because I know that’s an inequity I have and something that I have to improve on and I try. But. There’s only so much information that can be put in, but she’s she’s very gifted in that area of whereas on math fronts.

09;57;21;17 – 09;57;07;21
Nick “Cuts” 
She just hands me the the calculator. It’s like, Hey, go, this is this is your room. But simple things like that works the balance and the contrast is able to provide that, that foundation and that’s just that’s in the home unit.

09;57;07;21 – 09;56;45;07
Nick “Cuts” 
And then that outside of the family outside of the family unit then allows the society to better have a foundation of shared understanding, shared moral shared. You know, reality because we all understand, hey, we’re coming from a home where these are kind of our baseline understandings of a, you know, husband and wife relationship, and we walk into

09;56;45;07 – 09;56;26;13
Nick “Cuts” 
the job and we understand your interaction with people that they understand those same principles. And unfortunately, that’s I think that that directly correlates into that community concept of grit because. You can have personal great, but if other people don’t understand it, they can’t.

09;56;25;24 – 09;56;07;27
Nick “Cuts” 
They don’t know how to interact with you. You don’t know how to interact with them because they’re going to look at is, Oh, you’re just an overachiever. It’s like, No, this is just the baseline functions of being a functioning member of a cohesive family unit and bringing that forward into the real world or into a job setting

09;56;06;28 – 09;56;05;28
Nick “Cuts” 
. And that’s how it goes.

09;56;05;07 – 09;56;01;09
Jon
You know, society comes from the individuals through the family to the society, right?

09;56;00;25 – 09;56;00;17
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;55;59;25 – 09;55;52;29
Nick “Cuts” 
They’re not reverse. So society does not. Society should not inform the families of families. Should inform the society.

09;55;52;17 – 09;55;51;15
Lindsey
Absolutely agree with that.

09;55;51;00 – 09;55;45;24
Jon
Yeah, I agree. So we we’ve had we’ve been talking for a little bit and you are.

09;55;45;04 – 09;55;43;02
Lindsey
We should probably do an actual introduction like, oh.

09;55;42;27 – 09;55;42;20
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;55;41;18 – 09;55;40;22
Lindsey
Let’s force is.

09;55;40;22 – 09;55;32;11
Jon
So I have a quick story to describe one of many. It’s probably not flattering, but it sure is funny of Nick its fourth year.

09;55;31;25 – 09;55;30;03
Lindsey
So I’m nervous too for this Nick.

09;55;29;17 – 09;55;18;18
Jon
Our relationship started way back in the early days of college, so we’ve had quite a history. And there was one night in which we were being college aged males.

09;55;16;22 – 09;55;15;07
Lindsey
I think I know where this is going.

09;55;14;29 – 09;55;12;04
Jon
And I’ll just never forget the way the moonlight bounced.

09;55;12;03 – 09;55;11;26
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;55;11;16 – 09;55;10;08
Lindsey
Of waiting for the story.

09;55;10;07 – 09;55;06;06
Jon
Off of your back end as you ran and nothing but cowboy boots down the street because you are.

09;55;06;02 – 09;55;02;25
Nick “Cuts”
Oh yeah, that was. Oh man.

09;55;02;25 – 09;54;53;17
Nick “Cuts” 
That was a different time for sure. And I remember it having to hit the back of your truck to get in the back as well.

09;54;53;07 – 09;54;51;16
Nick “Cuts”
Because the car was covering this car.

09;54;49;21 – 09;54;47;12
Jon
So that was a good memory of it.

09;54;47;11 – 09;54;40;27
Nick “Cuts” 
Luckily, there was only one street light on, and that was the one that I had to run to. And then everything else was relatively dark.

09;54;40;10 – 09;54;39;23
Nick “Cuts”
Scary.

09;54;38;07 – 09;54;23;21
Jon
But it was a good time, a good memory. And you have been one who’s walked through with our family, everything from when we learned about Jeremiah. You hold me accountable for for not telling you guys the truth on some things.

09;54;22;00 – 09;54;17;29
Jon
And then you got you walked with Lindsey, and I helped us move into our first home and.

09;54;17;17 – 09;54;17;12
Nick “Cuts”
Help.

09;54;17;11 – 09;54;15;16
Jon
Welcome our first son into the world.

09;54;15;16 – 09;54;12;01
Nick “Cuts”
And I’m. We’re one of them, I.

09;54;11;17 – 09;54;10;18
Lindsey
Taught you a lot.

09;54;10;17 – 09;53;56;22
Jon
one of the the two grooms men I had and you. Yeah, it’s been good, and since then I’ve just gone on and the army’s taken us different ways, but we’ve always stayed connected, so it’s been a cool thing.

09;53;56;21 – 09;53;47;03
Jon
So you’re someone who’s a beloved part of my, my life and heart and our family, and it was about time we sat down and had a conversation like this.

09;53;46;20 – 09;53;36;05
Nick “Cuts” 
Yeah, absolutely. And same with you. I mean, you guys have walked through with me through lots of things starting in college. I mean, us going through the Avengers we did and the.

09;53;35;14 – 09;53;35;00
Nick “Cuts”
The.

09;53;34;22 – 09;53;27;14
Nick “Cuts” 
ROTC program and that that whole climate, as well as getting through our theology degrees together that was.

09;53;26;18 – 09;53;25;25
Nick “Cuts”
Sitting there with.

09;53;25;25 – 09;53;21;00
Lindsey
Your candle light and your your science music going to.

09;53;21;00 – 09;53;18;16
Nick “Cuts”
Oh no, it was not. It was a.

09;53;18;16 – 09;53;15;07
Nick “Cuts” 
Cathedral. My chance. Yeah.

09;53;14;28 – 09;53;13;16
Nick “Cuts”
Yes, there you go. Yeah.

09;53;13;08 – 09;53;07;04
Nick “Cuts” 
And our and our glasses of wine, as we pontificated about the apologetics of the day.

09;53;06;27 – 09;53;05;06
Jon
Probably just sounded foolish, but had.

09;53;05;06 – 09;53;02;15
Nick “Cuts”
Fun wake.

09;53;02;15 – 09;52;59;14
Nick “Cuts” 
Up the next day. Read the paper. What on earth did we write?

09;52;59;03 – 09;52;58;21
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;52;58;01 – 09;52;56;10
Lindsey
Oh, well, that’s what we wrote. Send it in.

09;52;55;23 – 09;52;55;11
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;52;55;05 – 09;52;45;21
Nick “Cuts” 
So um, but yeah, you guys have been there. We I think, like you said, twelve years is what I’m tracking because Jeremiah is about to be nine, right?

09;52;45;11 – 09;52;43;07
Lindsey
Yeah, he’ll be nine next year. Yeah, he just turned eight.

09;52;42;29 – 09;52;42;19
Nick “Cuts” 
Yeah.

09;52;42;19 – 09;52;39;00
Lindsey
So yeah, I’ve known you both since 2012.

09;52;37;12 – 09;52;36;03
Nick “Cuts” 
So, oh, so ten.

09;52;35;15 – 09;52;27;09
Lindsey
Yes, it’ll be ten, eleven September of this next year, so I’ve known you guys each for nine years. Yeah. So that means you guys have known each other longer.

09;52;27;08 – 09;52;23;12
Jon
Which is essentially the entire nation of my Adobe memory.

09;52;23;01 – 09;52;18;19
Nick “Cuts”
Yes, I don’t. Pretty much before. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

09;52;18;16 – 09;52;12;09
Nick “Cuts” 
Before, yeah, before adulthood is all like just trying to get to college. And then once you got to college, it’s.

09;52;10;17 – 09;52;08;18
Nick “Cuts”
So little about me.

09;52;07;19 – 09;51;47;27
Nick “Cuts” 
Grew up a military brat, so I was moved to Germany, moved all over. When people ask where I’m from, I will claim the South because that’s where I spend most of my life. But I will claim California as a good little flavor spring clean in the middle of my journey because of course, that’s where I’m at.

09;51;47;27 – 09;51;31;02
Nick “Cuts” 
You guys, I went to college, but it was not. It helped culture me, I guess you could say so that I wasn’t just stuck in the. This is the way, according The Mandalorian, a little bit there, but am I nerd and will come out even more so.

09;51;29;19 – 09;51;28;27
Jon
You just blown it.

09;51;28;18 – 09;51;27;14
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah, I love it.

09;51;27;07 – 09;51;19;29
Nick “Cuts” 
I have all the little pops in my office and people walk in and they walk right back out. If they are just, they know what they’re getting.

09;51;19;22 – 09;51;19;02
Nick “Cuts”
So.

09;51;17;14 – 09;50;51;29
Nick “Cuts” 
So yeah, I grew up bounced around quite a bit with my dad in and out of different jobs and then went to college, got a theology degree and then commissioned into the army. Has an intel officer been doing that for the past eight years and just having to having to figure out a lot of the stuff out

09;50;51;14 – 09;50;50;09
Nick “Cuts” 
as I was going along?

09;50;49;29 – 09;50;49;18
Nick “Cuts”
You know.

09;50;48;03 – 09;50;41;03
Nick “Cuts” 
Luckily, I had good friends and family that were able to help influence or at least speak some truth into my life at key points to help me.

09;50;39;25 – 09;50;38;28
Nick “Cuts”
Course, correct?

09;50;36;27 – 09;50;16;23
Nick “Cuts” 
And not go down. You know, the use my talents and my skills for things that I ought not to. And so here I am, married to an amazing woman and have my first baby boy so well. second. second child, because we have the first child.

09;50;16;09 – 09;50;15;01
Nick “Cuts”
Oh, so hard.

09;50;15;01 – 09;50;14;21
Nick “Cuts” 
To claim.

09;50;14;21 – 09;50;11;19
Nick “Cuts”
Rudeness. But yeah, so.

09;50;09;03 – 09;50;00;17
Nick “Cuts” 
It’s good and. Yeah, so that’s kind of a little bit about me. That’s who I am, where I came from.

09;49;59;19 – 09;49;58;06
Jon
That’s a that’s a high and view.

09;49;56;21 – 09;49;55;06
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah, that’s that’s a three.

09;49;55;06 – 09;49;54;13
Nick “Cuts” 
Thousand five U.

09;49;53;29 – 09;49;31;08
Lindsey
Okay, so what are some of the struggles when you are bouncing around as a military brat that you’ve taken from childhood that you’ve overcome learned? How do you like kind of adapt your character, your your resilience skills? What what are some of those that you’ve carried on that are still good ones to have as an adult who

09;49;28;16 – 09;49;27;17
Nick “Cuts”
? I think the.

09;49;27;17 – 09;49;03;08
Nick “Cuts” 
Big thing for me is is always having a plan. The only certain thing about the military is the uncertainty. You know, there’s everything’s changing constant, constant flux change. Here we have a set schedule. It’s going to change the ability to have a plan, even if it doesn’t stick or stay, at least gives you the direction you want

09;49;03;08 – 09;48;42;21
Nick “Cuts” 
to go. So, hey, we’re going to move to Indiana. You know, that was our big the most recent big change, you know, and the top five stressors, right, moving, changing jobs, sickness, death and divorce or having children in divorce, right?

09;48;42;19 – 09;48;38;23
Nick “Cuts” 
Those are like the top six big stressors. So we had a changing job.

09;48;37;10 – 09;48;33;19
Nick “Cuts”
Jack baby on the way. Yeah, yeah. Baby, you almost.

09;48;33;19 – 09;48;32;22
Lindsey
Are pregnant, right?

09;48;32;12 – 09;48;19;03
Nick “Cuts” 
Yeah, exactly. So the three of the top six. And so having the plan though, hey, you know what? We have this free time. Prior to us getting up there, we had spring break and we decided, Hey, you know what?

09;48;19;03 – 09;48;07;10
Nick “Cuts” 
We’re going to fly up, we’re going to go take a look at the area, you know, doing a little bit that assessment beforehand, collecting all the information so we can make an educated decision instead of just, hey, willy nilly, just go for it.

09;48;06;19 – 09;47;56;14
Nick “Cuts” 
I think that was something I learned watching. The countless times we moved in just didn’t have a plan. We didn’t know where we’re going. We’re just going to stay with family until we figure it out once we got there.

09;47;55;08 – 09;47;40;20
Nick “Cuts” 
Definitely drove home the narrative of Hey. You need to be able to look at the where you want to go, what their end goal is and start collecting the information, I mean, especially with me being an intel guy.

09;47;39;19 – 09;47;25;12
Nick “Cuts” 
Data need the data points. I need the information and Lawrence the same way. We need the information so we can make an educated decision because we the one thing we hate is and decisiveness in the inability to pay.

09;47;25;12 – 09;47;12;09
Nick “Cuts” 
You know what, we’ve we’ve looked at all the information. We can actually make a decision not to say that in the moment, sometimes you can make a rash decision, but if you have the time. Don’t procrastinate and actually invest into that.

09;47;12;09 – 09;46;57;25
Nick “Cuts” 
Planning is going to pay dividends. And so that was something definitely learned. The other thing is. Also, not always being married to your initial plan, you know, so a.

09;46;57;24 – 09;46;57;03
Jon
Times, literally.

09;46;56;18 – 09;46;55;23
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah, exactly.

09;46;53;16 – 09;46;52;11
Nick “Cuts” 
So don’t.

09;46;52;09 – 09;46;50;07
Nick “Cuts”
Don’t say it once you.

09;46;49;10 – 09;46;37;02
Nick “Cuts” 
Once you’ve made the plan. If things change. Be willing to adapt. And that that’s the big thing is things are going to change. Things are going to alter. But if you have an end goal already establishing, know where you want to go.

09;46;36;11 – 09;46;21;24
Nick “Cuts” 
It’s easier to correct back to that lighthouse per se than to just sit and be like, Well, that didn’t work. We’re just going to throw the whole thing away. The plans still viable. It’s just you’ve got to change how you’re getting to that end goal.

09;46;20;27 – 09;46;06;10
Nick “Cuts” 
And so that that was something definitely learned with moving around all the time. Because if I moved between first grade and senior year of high school, I went to eight different schools. Mm-Hmm.

09;46;05;03 – 09;46;04;07
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah, that’s a line.

09;46;03;08 – 09;45;49;26
Nick “Cuts” 
And if I had not developed that concept of, hey, the end goal is getting to college or the end goal is getting through high school and my high school diploma, all the moves in the middle would be, Oh, you know, this school was this way, the schools.

09;45;49;26 – 09;45;36;13
Nick “Cuts” 
That way I can’t I can’t pursue my education because I’m constantly changing the environment. I knew where I wanted to go at the end, and that’s that was the final goal, at least at that point in time. And so.

09;45;35;14 – 09;45;26;02
Nick “Cuts” 
Whatever happened in between was going to happen as long as at the end I was able to do this final thing. It was good to go. So that’s one of them.

09;45;24;15 – 09;45;23;26
Nick “Cuts”
Trying.

09;45;23;24 – 09;45;10;13
Nick “Cuts” 
To gain or actually to. Trying to think of other things I learned. Learned how to be. Particularly with those who I trusted with relationship.

09;45;09;20 – 09;45;08;17
Nick “Cuts”
Mm hmm. You know.

09;45;07;14 – 09;44;52;12
Nick “Cuts” 
I’ll be nice to everybody. Everybody upfront gets the initial respect of being a human being and the basic respect of, Hey, you and I come from different places. We don’t know each other, but I’m going to respect you enough to treat you with that respect.

09;44;51;12 – 09;44;38;01
Nick “Cuts” 
And it’s your it’s your job to either continue to foster that relationship and we work together and we have that mutual trust. But the moment you start degrading that, it’s it’s harder to get back to that initial respect level.

09;44;38;00 – 09;44;22;25
Nick “Cuts” 
You can always go up, but once you start going down, it’s really hard to get back and you can make friends quick. But the depth of the relationship isn’t always going to present itself because again, you’re moving so often.

09;44;20;24 – 09;44;02;09
Nick “Cuts” 
Developing those deep relationship is a two way street. And like we’ve seen in our, you know, 1112 years of friendship, there’s times when we won’t talk for months at a time. And it’s not because we don’t want to just like happens, but it’s the reconnecting on the back side of, Hey, how’s things going?

09;44;02;08 – 09;43;47;04
Nick “Cuts” 
And we actually sit down and have a conversation. A lot of people don’t understand that concept because they don’t understand that it’s a two way street. Just because we don’t see each other everyday doesn’t mean that you’re not a friend or you’re not family or you’re not this.

09;43;47;04 – 09;43;33;28
Nick “Cuts” 
It’s having to understand that it’s both ways and being able to reach out. And in those regards, that’s huge. And that goes back to that whole community piece of we get it. You get to understand each other better.

09;43;32;02 – 09;43;27;01
Nick “Cuts” 
And you don’t always have to be right next to each other every single day on top of each other, like we were.

09;43;26;22 – 09;43;23;25
Nick “Cuts”
In college because we were.

09;43;23;13 – 09;43;17;29
Nick “Cuts” 
It was awesome. But there are mornings where I’m pretty sure you wanted to throw me out of the truck as you’re driving.

09;43;16;12 – 09;43;16;01
Nick “Cuts”
Well.

09;43;15;13 – 09;43;09;24
Jon
So it is fair. I’m a talker. I can be quite a talker. Nothing compares to you.

09;43;09;07 – 09;43;06;16
Nick “Cuts”
Oh, I woke up this s Lauren.

09;43;06;08 – 09;42;56;10
Jon
Like a canary. I would take some time to have the tranquil morning silence before I’d be ready to talk. So when were waking up at 34 in the morning to to make the drive, to do what we had to do?

09;42;55;19 – 09;42;44;13
Jon
We’d get in that car, the engine would start and so would your mouth. And this is not without my faults. There’s many times that I deserved a licking from you. But in those mornings there were there were times where.

09;42;43;12 – 09;42;43;07
Nick “Cuts”
It.

09;42;43;07 – 09;42;42;16
Jon
Was a struggle.

09;42;41;22 – 09;42;40;03
Nick “Cuts”
I had to do this.

09;42;39;18 – 09;42;28;18
Jon
It’s yeah, he just see my hands slowly start to go to the dashboard to turn the music up. And you just look at me. Am I talking too much? And I just look at him and be like, Yes, yes you are.

09;42;26;28 – 09;42;26;15
Nick “Cuts”
Which is.

09;42;26;15 – 09;42;24;14
Jon
Hilarious, but it’s a good memory.

09;42;23;08 – 09;42;12;11
Nick “Cuts” 
So those are those are the things that are absolutely important. And those things would have allowed me to continue to proceed forward. So.

09;42;12;01 – 09;42;03;23
Jon
Well, you’re you’re spot on, man, because like that, there’s this idea that you’re going to be a superhero and things happen. Right.

09;42;03;15 – 09;42;03;06
Nick “Cuts”
Right.

09;42;02;14 – 09;41;49;29
Jon
And really, you’re just going to fall to the lowest level, whatever your preparation is. But at the same time, if you don’t have that plan, then you’re going to really fall to whatever your lowest preparation is. It’s like I was just thinking about this issue of the day.

09;41;49;29 – 09;41;37;23
Jon
If I don’t want to have if someone doesn’t want to eat sweets that day or like drink at a party or something if they don’t make a deliberate plan and decision in advance not to when they get there, they will.

09;41;37;09 – 09;41;36;29
Nick “Cuts”
Well, the.

09;41;36;29 – 09;41;20;17
Jon
Same is true. Talking about like the move to Indiana, let’s go evaluate what’s going on, let’s let’s put some plans in place to protect against the worst case scenario and then let’s work towards the best and understand that there’s going to be variables we can’t control, right?

09;41;20;17 – 09;41;03;25
Jon
No plan survives first contact, but. We’re going to do the best to aim to to get to the target we’ve established in this plan and and then go from there and say, well, if you don’t identify and describe what that target is with that goal is and then you don’t put a plan to get there.

09;41;03;07 – 09;40;57;26
Jon
That’s the only way we can guarantee you certainly will not get there, right? Right. Or the rest of it’s a game.

09;40;57;02 – 09;40;56;11
Nick “Cuts” 
Exactly.

09;40;56;11 – 09;40;51;22
Nick “Cuts”
And and it’s it’s made.

09;40;51;22 – 09;40;39;02
Nick “Cuts” 
Even better with that that partner in that adventure because, you know, you’ve said a couple of times on different podcast, you know, if you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go further, go together, right?

09;40;38;09 – 09;40;36;15
Nick “Cuts” 
That I’m pretty sure that’s how.

09;40;36;15 – 09;40;35;12
Nick “Cuts”
You get that one, right?

09;40;34;00 – 09;40;33;01
Jon
Yeah, that’s it.

09;40;32;16 – 09;40;13;25
Nick “Cuts” 
But again, it drives back to that family unit, right? Because sure, it can go a lot faster. I could get things done a lot quicker. As an individual, but if you’re get dealt with everything fast, you’re not able to take those moments and enjoy life along the way.

09;40;13;07 – 09;39;53;15
Nick “Cuts” 
And I think having a family further that furthers that concept. And again, that goes back to the whole day that drives into the societal side of things of Hey, we can progress so rapidly. But if we’re not waiting and enjoying the the changes as we’re kind of and seeing what the changes are going to present themselves as

09;39;53;15 – 09;39;37;03
Nick “Cuts” 
we make policy changes or we make business decisions and things like that, and we don’t take the time to kind of slow down, wait and see the actual effects of them and just constantly are changing things. We’re never going to have stability, you know that again.

09;39;36;26 – 09;39;14;21
Nick “Cuts” 
And I think that’s something that’s definitely been learned through trial and error. Is when you constantly are changing little things and not letting the previous changes take effect. You’re not going to have a clear understanding or picture of what’s going on, you’re just going to see a new snapshot each time.

09;39;13;27 – 09;38;55;17
Nick “Cuts” 
And I think the average if you make a change in like a business or a policy change you’re looking at. You know, anywhere between two to four years worth the time change for the the effects of whatever change you made to happen, right?

09;38;55;01 – 09;38;42;18
Nick “Cuts” 
That’s when you’re finally going to be sick. But if you’re making changes every year this system, you’re never going to figure out at what point the system became self-sufficient or able to be efficient in and of itself.

09;38;41;27 – 09;38;41;17
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;38;41;00 – 09;38;32;16
Jon
But there’s there’s too. I saw this really cool idea of like whatever you’re doing today, you’ll see the results of it 90 days from now. Right. So it’s like.

09;38;32;16 – 09;38;32;03
Nick “Cuts” 
Exactly.

09;38;31;27 – 09;38;12;17
Jon
You’re not going to see tomorrow, but nine days from now and then when you’re talking about when or what I’m perceiving as you’re talking about it, it’s like if we don’t be careful to protect and preserve and pursue that, the dignity of and the dignity of the humanity of others when we’re making these changes.

09;38;12;16 – 09;37;59;21
Jon
There’s a lot of descriptors there. But if we’re not protecting that dignity and pursuing the humanity in these changes, then we find ourselves making decisions that it’ll be too late by the time we’re seeing the ramifications of them.

09;37;59;08 – 09;37;47;29
Nick “Cuts” 
Exactly. Absolutely. I mean, we’ve seen that in history and, you know, we’ve seen it in modern times. We’ve seen it all throughout. I mean, even the past year or two.

09;37;47;29 – 09;37;47;17
Nick “Cuts”
With.

09;37;46;08 – 09;37;29;28
Nick “Cuts” 
That getting a super political. But the COVID, you know, the mandate from the coverage and and the different things it was like every other week, something was changing because nobody was going to take well. Yeah, but nobody was willing to take that pause and be like, Oh, let’s let’s let’s let this one change.

09;37;29;28 – 09;37;09;18
Nick “Cuts” 
We did take effect and see what’s happening. And then, you know, even, for example, working out, Hey, I’m going to go train or whatever physically. I’m going to change all this stuff all at once and probably injure yourself pretty good, you know, like, hey, I want to do more cardio.

09;37;09;10 – 09;36;54;16
Nick “Cuts” 
But I also want to put on mass. And you’re going to go run five miles and then turn around and squat £500 that same day. It’s like, that’s your. Yeah, choose one or the other and slowly progress into.

09;36;53;17 – 09;36;51;23
Nick “Cuts” 
Symmetric, you know, symmetry.

09;36;51;14 – 09;36;28;05
Jon
Yeah, I think you can get there if you have if you make a proper strategy, but like from personal experience. So this last year, it’s very difficult to shock your system in the pursuit of, like, say, both strength and stamina right on a large sweeping scale up front because like skeletal and ligaments and tendons, they’re not going

09;36;28;05 – 09;36;17;13
Jon
to evolve fast enough for that. I do think if you if you update your strategy, you can eventually get there, but you have to choose what your priorities are going to be along the way in what’s going faster.

09;36;16;25 – 09;36;13;17
Nick “Cuts” 
Really, that’s interesting is that that planning aspect, for sure.

09;36;13;03 – 09;36;12;22
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;36;12;06 – 09;35;58;04
Jon
And earlier you were talking about the the value with the family coming in enriching life and the idea of, you know, the quote. We always talk about the old African proverb that you want to go fast, go alone.

09;35;57;22 – 09;35;45;21
Jon
If you want to go far, go together. The only problem with that is if you traveled, the wrong people could really suck. And even if you travel with the right people, they’re not going to be with you the entire length of the journey all the time.

09;35;45;08 – 09;35;32;03
Jon
So there’s a lot of pain that comes in to choosing to be in relationship and community, whether it’s with people who should be lifelong partners or whether it’s with people. You want to be lifelong partners, whether that’s friendship, romantic or what have you.

09;35;30;08 – 09;35;15;02
Jon
And then realizing that it may just be a short season or a short time because of all sorts of unknown variables, and it can become very easy to want to separate yourself right when it starts to really hurt.

09;35;14;20 – 09;35;14;11
Nick “Cuts”
Mm-Hmm.

09;35;13;03 – 09;34;54;09
Jon
But the you know, the price of the joy of love and being in community with others is the pain of loss. And I do think that the that price that we all have to pay is worth paying in full for all eternity, for the memories that we have with those we love.

09;34;54;01 – 09;34;46;02
Lindsey
It’s like the quote from. We’ve been watching the film a boy called Christmas. It’s on Netflix. It’s really cute.

09;34;45;25 – 09;34;42;29
Nick “Cuts” 
Oh, we were. We’re looking at watching it for you.

09;34;42;25 – 09;34;33;01
Lindsey
Oh my gosh. Okay, you need to watch it. And one of the quotes that they say in it is grief is the price you pay for love, but it’s worth it 1,000,000 times over and it’s true. Mm-Hmm.

09;34;32;09 – 09;34;23;14
Nick “Cuts”
And go ahead. All right, thanks. Yeah, next, speak, Nick.

09;34;22;18 – 09;33;57;04
Nick “Cuts” 
Yeah, so the concept, I mean, it’s it’s biblical, right? Because what is love has no great love. There’s been a man may lay down his life for another, right? What you’re doing in that moment of choosing relationship, choosing love, choosing people is you are dying to your own self interest who you are as a person and not

09;33;57;04 – 09;33;38;00
Nick “Cuts” 
in the sense of like, Oh, I can’t be an individual, I can’t have my individual thoughts, but rather. We, as humans inherently are going to want to do things that benefit us solely and by turning and flipping the script and actually choosing to put others before ourselves, we are intentionally.

09;33;37;00 – 09;33;16;18
Nick “Cuts” 
Building that loving relationship in pushing forward in the way that Christ said that we needed to end the marriage is the the example or the foundation of that. And you’re right, if you have the wrong person that crumbles, you know, it’s like building your house on the sand it’s going to wash away versus if you find those

09;33;16;18 – 09;33;03;12
Nick “Cuts” 
people. And that’s why talking about that intentionality, it’s a two way street and building into those relationships, you know, a hey, we all have the same level of respect by as soon as you degrade it, it’s going to call the, you know, I’m going to call it.

09;33;03;12 – 09;32;43;16
Nick “Cuts” 
I can cut that off because to me, if that relationship isn’t, isn’t giving or speaking truth into a life or isn’t giving something back to my family or the collective society as a whole, then it then it needs to be cut off because it’s not going to bear fruit and it’s just going to poison the well.

09;32;42;27 – 09;32;29;15
Jon
Maybe. Yeah. Well, back in episode one, I talked about and we’re so far removed now, just spit it out again. There’s this idea that we’re talking about with relationships, right where grass is always greener on the other side.

09;32;28;17 – 09;32;18;19
Jon
And I want to build on your point of like, it’s really important to pick the right people and find the right people to start those relationships with. But then there’s the second piece, right? Like, let’s say you do.

09;32;18;05 – 09;32;01;27
Jon
You are in relationship with the right person, and that relationship is a shared lawn. There’s no greener grass anywhere. You have this shared lawn and you just get fatigued under the price of cultivation. Right? Are they watering it or if they fertilizing it, are you or you both weeding it?

09;32;01;27 – 09;31;44;00
Jon
Are you both tending it and protecting it, nourishing it? And if not, then is it dying because you’re growing fatigued or is it dying because of your neglect? Right. And those are all components in it. And I think that it can become very tedious and painful to have to weed that lawn out and to have to tend

09;31;44;00 – 09;31;28;04
Jon
it with the relationship. But there’s the two sides of the there’s the two sides of the coin, one you need to be very intentional on who your inner circle is going to be. And then two, you have to be even more intentional after the decision’s been made to live in community with someone on how you’re going to

09;31;27;06 – 09;31;22;27
Jon
grow that relationship and invest in it over time. Mm hmm.

09;31;21;25 – 09;31;04;00
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. Because you’re right, it’s as you go down the road of life, you know, the constant changes, the constant having to readjust. I mean, we we change with time. We aren’t stationary creatures. We don’t just, Hey, this is who I am.

09;31;04;00 – 09;30;44;03
Nick “Cuts” 
This is who I will always be. We have certain characteristics, certain things that we maintain throughout our entire life. You know, our personalities, who we are as people. Some of the things we hold value in. But there’s things in circumstances that change how we express those or how those come out and the way in which we present

09;30;44;03 – 09;30;26;05
Nick “Cuts” 
them. And so in that you’re right, the here’s my lawn. And you know, this season of life, it’s it’s summer. So I got to put a little bit of extra water on there. I got to make sure that good fertilizer out there, that’s going to hold that moisture to the ground so the grass doesn’t die out, but

09;30;26;05 – 09;30;10;17
Nick “Cuts” 
also have to have that communication with the other person about, Hey, hey, don’t put too much fertilizer or Hey, I water this morning when you are this afternoon and it becomes a give and take, it’s not a 5050, it’s it’s ebb and flow of a relationship in that regard.

09;30;09;20 – 09;29;49;10
Nick “Cuts” 
And over time that but you have to have that constant communication about it because if you’re not communicating about what is going on, the grass is going to die out. And over time, if you stop communicating, it only exacerbates that problem gets bigger and bigger and bigger to the point of where even if you are communicating, the

09;29;49;10 – 09;29;28;23
Nick “Cuts” 
grass is dead, you have a dirt field and you have to restart over at a different point in time compared to where you were in the beginning. So, yeah, no, I think that you’re absolutely right in that tediousness is why it’s a labor of love to maintain that relationship, because think of how many times we fail on

09;29;28;23 – 09;29;07;11
Nick “Cuts” 
a regular basis. And yet God still is willing to give us those chances and opportunities and still willing to have a relationship with us. And that’s the very I mean, that’s that’s the perfect example of what he’s calling us as people to do, because that’s that’s that’s the ultimate example.

09;29;06;11 – 09;28;49;18
Nick “Cuts” 
And I get it, there’s people out there that will say, oh, you know, that’s that’s age old proverb that doesn’t fit in modern society, but look at where modern society is. We’ve gotten away from that. We’ve gone to the individual, you know, individual is is only as good as the individual’s going to get.

09;28;48;25 – 09;28;32;18
Nick “Cuts” 
As a collective, we can be greater, but nobody wants to to to have those hard conversations and actually communicate and communicate in shared understanding to build a better society. Now I got I’m getting mine, you get yours and we’re good.

09;28;32;15 – 09;28;29;00
Nick “Cuts” 
We’ll call it a day. That’s not how things should be good.

09;28;29;00 – 09;28;14;16
Jon
Good luck creating your own ideals like the tragedy of trying to lose the wisdom traditions of our past and learn from them and pull from them and enrich life for them is is a significant loss, right?

09;28;13;22 – 09;27;51;13
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. I mean, thousands of years worth of history and in life, and you’re sitting now on the backside of it and saying within the past hundred years, we figured out more than thousands of years before us. Yeah, that’s that’s Idiocracy.

09;27;51;05 – 09;27;47;04
Nick “Cuts” 
That’s absolute. I can’t find the word right now.

09;27;46;29 – 09;27;39;02
Jon
It’s lunacy to think that we’re smarter than all of our history and that there’s not some value we can pull from that legacy. Continue forward.

09;27;39;02 – 09;27;37;16
Nick “Cuts”
With. Right? You know, sure.

09;27;37;15 – 09;27;14;25
Nick “Cuts” 
We may be scientifically more advanced. But that that that’s about this much versus everything else there needs to be focus on, you know, because sure, science is great in its modern medicine and modern whatever is awesome. But you have thousands of years of other personal relationships and just.

09;27;13;21 – 09;27;12;11
Nick “Cuts” 
What arts and theories.

09;27;11;12 – 09;26;52;27
Jon
It’s interesting because science is a method, it’s a tool, it’s a means of like seeking understanding in the world and solving problems and gaining insight. It’s not an explanation for how and why we’re here. So like to put it in its own box, I think really subjugates it to a lesser version of itself and what it is

09;26;52;27 – 09;26;30;11
Jon
capable of helping us gain understanding and then to take in the open the aperture up and take in all of human experience with what we can learn from the pursuits that we engage with through the scientific method. But I think people get scared of having their ideas shifted up, regardless of what the source of that shifting is

09;26;30;00 – 09;26;26;25
Jon
, and it causes this desire to kind of up or down.

09;26;26;07 – 09;26;24;29
Nick “Cuts” 
And yeah.

09;26;24;19 – 09;26;23;26
Nick “Cuts”
Right off.

09;26;23;19 – 09;26;22;11
Nick “Cuts” 
And be entrenched.

09;26;21;26 – 09;26;20;24
Jon
And be entrenched.

09;26;18;08 – 09;26;12;28
Nick “Cuts” 
Like, there’s a great podcast that’s talking about entrenching those preconceived infringements.

09;26;12;10 – 09;26;11;28
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;26;10;28 – 09;25;59;20
Jon
So right. It’s actually funny you bring that up because that that series that we do is going to go on a bit of a sabbatical for a. So I’m glad that you you mentioned it. That decision was made this morning, actually.

09;25;59;08 – 09;25;52;25
Jon
So it’s not gone. It’s just going to have a different frequency and rhythm over the coming future and but.

09;25;52;25 – 09;25;51;19
Lindsey
Still addressing the same issues?

09;25;51;15 – 09;25;30;12
Nick “Cuts” 
Correct? Yeah, absolutely. I think I think you have those those nuggets in time and space at pivotal moments. Awesome idea, you know, because I think every week it gets a little intense to try to drum that thought and put real deep thought into some of those things that need that deep, deep thought.

09;25;30;12 – 09;25;14;02
Nick “Cuts” 
A week is not, not always the best. I’m speaking from personal experience like my with my masters right now, writing two page papers every two weeks. There’s sometimes from like I. I don’t have the mental capacity to invest the amount of information required for this.

09;25;13;10 – 09;25;12;09
Nick “Cuts” 
Do it because.

09;25;11;16 – 09;25;11;03
Jon
You have.

09;25;11;00 – 09;25;10;20
Lindsey
Time.

09;25;10;17 – 09;25;04;05
Jon
But then the quality changes, right? And that’s one of the realizations I had. There’s a few variables, but like goodness, it’s a it’s a lot of.

09;25;04;05 – 09;25;03;24
Nick “Cuts”
Work.

09;25;03;16 – 09;24;46;17
Jon
To formulate and brainstorm with Lindsay for coffee and grit and for great theory episodes once a week. So do to continue expanding that. We’re going to say something now to continue expanding that and to add to have more on that on that rhythm.

09;24;46;08 – 09;24;29;19
Jon
It made sense at the start because that’s what’s comfortable with. But then, you know, after we talked this morning, I was like, This is something that we should. Used when there’s something that’s really screaming to be shared and to be explored and allowed to have that type of rhythm in life to it.

09;24;29;09 – 09;24;10;10
Jon
So I think they’ll be healthier for the entrenched side, you know, allow us a little bit more resources to, you know, just save energy and mental capital to keep doing the stuff that we’re doing here. And it’s, you know, we’re excited too, because even with this show, we’re entering a little period where Lynchian are going to be

09;24;10;10 – 09;23;59;04
Jon
looking at what are we wanting to do with it at this point, right? Because we feel like we’re at another milestone another fork in the road, if you will. It’s OK. Like, how do we want to continue pursuing this?

09;23;58;27 – 09;23;47;04
Jon
And what does that look like and what will the future hold depending on those decisions? And part of that was let’s have conversations with people we truly love. Let’s just have some good conversations.

09;23;47;04 – 09;23;34;18
Lindsey
With people we’ve seen throughout their lives. These aren’t, you know, like with you, we’ve known you for a long time and we’ve watched you grind it out day in, day out, and we’ve walked through some really big life events together.

09;23;34;10 – 09;23;13;01
Lindsey
But you still have this great, this resiliency to push forward and become better. You’ve not just stopped and been like, Well, this is it, and this is where I’ll stay. So that’s kind of we’re looking inward into our our circles and really trying to be like, why don’t we have these types of people because they’re demonstrating what

09;23;13;01 – 09;23;07;03
Lindsey
we want and they’re part of our community. And so I think that that’s really where we’re wanting to go with it, too.

09;23;06;19 – 09;22;50;04
Jon
Yeah, absolutely. It is kind of like a two foot then one. It’s like, we need to recharge and have the conversations with the people that have helped create this mentality for us. And to by doing that, we also get to share that mentality as we’re figuring out the direction we want to launch from kind of gathering in

09;22;50;04 – 09;22;37;03
Jon
the resources, if you will, on the next stage to become way makers and stuff. So like it, it is really good. And you know, with all that, I did have a question for you that’s been kind of floating in my mind to build up the woman.

09;22;37;03 – 09;22;16;05
Jon
Lindsay asked, At what point? There’s some. There’s some pieces of your life, I hope we talk about. But at what point did you realize that it’s up to you to determine the outcome of the type of life you’re going to be leading and living, and that it’s not on anyone else and that you can’t even rely on

09;22;16;05 – 09;22;08;00
Jon
anyone else because ultimately it’s yours to take take responsibility of. But when did that realization really begin the hard way?

09;22;07;17 – 09;21;44;02
Nick “Cuts” 
I think I think that’s always going to be a constant struggle for anybody that you have to take accountability for your own life. And external influences, you know? They are what they are. But you have to take you have to take hold and take the bull by the horns and do it yourself.

09;21;41;02 – 09;21;24;02
Nick “Cuts” 
I would say that that really started happening the first kind of wake-up call of like, Hey, I need to I need to actually take a stand for myself and do the right thing. I was with sophomore year of college when everything just kind of went sideways on the home front.

09;21;23;01 – 09;21;05;14
Nick “Cuts” 
You know, with my family, things were just not not good. There is just not there’s a lot there that was that was happening. My dad lost his job. There was my parents divorced and there were two little ones there.

09;21;04;26 – 09;20;45;05
Nick “Cuts” 
My little brother and sister. And realizing that if I didn’t change my course in how I interacted with that current situation and prepare myself and get myself to the next step of graduating commissioned, I wouldn’t be able to provide.

09;20;43;29 – 09;20;31;03
Nick “Cuts” 
You know, a sounding board or a place of safety for the for my brother and sister, that was kind of that initial like, Hey, I can’t I can’t keep feeding into this, this relationship here because it’s at that point in time.

09;20;31;03 – 09;20;09;10
Nick “Cuts” 
It was just not not a good place to be. And then I think the next wake-up call was when I was on or when I got ready for deployment and realizing that I had a team, but. I was the one that I was having to prepare and get mentally prepared to go do this thing in Afghanistan, like

09;20;08;20 – 09;19;57;16
Nick “Cuts” 
nobody else was going to be able to go and do what I was going to do. Like I couldn’t have somebody come and fill my job and because we didn’t have the personnel to do it. And at the time.

09;19;55;10 – 09;19;36;11
Nick “Cuts” 
You know, my my first marriage was just on the rocks and and there was even on that front of, hey, you know, like, I got to figure this out on my own. And I don’t have the, you know, the support at home anymore because that’s that ship sailed.

09;19;36;11 – 09;19;23;26
Nick “Cuts” 
And I got to figure this out and I had family and friends that I could reach out to. But it was a realization like, I have to do this, you know, nobody else is going to do this. Nobody else is going to come and rescue me.

09;19;23;16 – 09;19;03;15
Nick “Cuts” 
This is me and I got to do it. She is so those were the two big wakeup calls, but I think it’s a continuing evolution every next step. There’s always a moment where it’s like you can resource, you can ask people for help, but there comes a point at which it’s it’s you.

09;19;02;04 – 09;18;51;01
Nick “Cuts” 
And now it’s me and Lauren, and that’s all. That’s the only two people we have that nobody else can. We can ask for help, but nobody else is just going to come and rescue us and save the day because that’s not.

09;18;49;28 – 09;18;34;14
Nick “Cuts” 
That’s not how we want our lives to be. We don’t want our lives to be dependent in the sense of we have to rely on other people to just take care of ourselves. We can rely on other people to strengthen and speak truth into our lives and to to grow as a community.

09;18;33;07 – 09;18;12;17
Nick “Cuts” 
But I don’t expect the community to come over, wash my dishes. Take out my trash. Change greens, diapers. You know, things like that that seem so tiny. But our very fundamental and you have to take accountability of how are you going to address the world and address your family relationships?

09;18;10;17 – 09;17;47;05
Nick “Cuts” 
So fair. I mean, those are the those are the big moments that kind of eye opening of like I can’t rely on others to. Fix my problems, I have to take accountability, I have to stand up, and I have to actually make a way forward for myself and I listen to others plans for my life.

09;17;47;04 – 09;17;45;17
Nick “Cuts” 
I have to have plans for my life.

09;17;41;15 – 09;17;27;23
Jon
Did you find? So something I experience with this is that there’s a lot of pain leading up to the realization of like, Oh, I’m not bearing up under this weight as much as I should be. Right? And then there’s a lot of pain in realizing I have to bear up under that way that I have to take

09;17;27;23 – 09;17;13;16
Jon
that responsibility. But then once I make the choice of I’m owning this, no one’s coming in to save me. I’m, you know, it doesn’t mean I’m alone, and the only one in the world is doing it, but it means that I’ve received the support I can get.

09;17;13;16 – 09;16;59;14
Jon
But it’s my fight, right? Like if I’m if I’m a boxer in a ring and it’s in between rounds and I come over to you, you’re going to wake me up, give me a drink, give me some encouragement, give me some coaching to help me figure out what I’m not seeing because I’m in the fight.

09;16;59;04 – 09;16;44;12
Jon
But then when that bell rings again, right? I’m the one going in there. So, yeah. Correct. So like with that, I find, is that there’s this immense peace that comes when I wake up. I love how you made this a journey thing.

09;16;44;12 – 09;16;27;26
Jon
It’s not an initial it’s a continuous decision to take responsibility in seeking out where am I missing? The level of responsibility I ought to be taking in this right, because once your eyes open to Oh man, I’ve been smirking this right, I’ve been looking for someone to fix this, but it’s on me.

09;16;27;14 – 09;16;17;13
Jon
This piece, at least for me, comes over still with the pain of the problem, but of at least I can do something. There’s a relief, you know? Have you felt that way to you?

09;16;17;03 – 09;16;15;06
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. I think that.

09;16;14;05 – 09;16;13;20
Nick “Cuts”
The.

09;16;13;18 – 09;15;52;25
Nick “Cuts” 
Big and it didn’t come until Lorne and I were married and sitting down one day and watching what was going on with, you know, my younger siblings and and their mom and watching the struggles they went through. And it’s like, man, I went through the seeing some of those same things.

09;15;52;25 – 09;15;27;00
Nick “Cuts” 
I didn’t have the support, though, you know? But I went through some of those same emotions and the realization that. I don’t have to live in fear of. You know, that person coming back and influencing my life anymore that I don’t have to think about, you know, think about life in the way of how are they perceive

09;15;27;00 – 09;15;07;28
Nick “Cuts” 
it? Because it it is in a part of my life anymore. I don’t have to interact with that anymore. I I’m past that point in my journey. And it informs some of my decisions of how do I interact with people that are like that that are, you know, condescending, insulting, toxic.

09;15;07;01 – 09;14;54;28
Nick “Cuts” 
I can I can pick it out. I can see it, and I know how to interact with it in a more effective, in a more efficient level is you don’t you don’t play into it. You don’t, you don’t interact with it.

09;14;54;28 – 09;14;34;16
Nick “Cuts” 
You don’t give them that satisfaction because you have that ability now and you can stand up in your own person and be able to to push back against it. And yeah, it gives you peace, because now even interacting at the office or interacting with people, you know, like at my last unit with the whole situation there, that

09;14;34;16 – 09;14;20;14
Nick “Cuts” 
was so incredibly just backwards and toxic. I was able to stand at the end of the day and say I did everything I could. I did the right thing. It gave, you know, I gave my 100% and all.

09;14;19;23 – 09;14;01;03
Nick “Cuts” 
And if somebody else didn’t like what I had to say or who I was and me standing my ground and the morals and character I had, that’s on them. But I did the right thing. And that was. But that didn’t come until after having the realization that other people don’t get to tell me how to live my

09;14;01;03 – 09;13;48;11
Nick “Cuts” 
life and the regards of if I have a moral standard in standing, I’m going to stick to it and I’m going to hold that ground. And I’m not going to, and I’m not going to back down when I know that it’s the right course of action.

09;13;47;25 – 09;13;33;02
Nick “Cuts” 
And then having the support of, you know, an amazing wife who stood beside me and was like, Hey, no, you’re right. You got you got to stand that ground. And then you and Jordan in Lindsay. When I called you guys, I was like, Hey, this is the situation.

09;13;32;17 – 09;13;17;04
Nick “Cuts” 
What do you do? And you guys, your poor guys, is responses. Well, do you feel that would you feel horrible if you didn’t take that stand? six months to now, if you look back? Are you going to regret not making the stand?

09;13;17;03 – 09;13;16;14
Nick “Cuts” 
I said, Yeah.

09;13;15;09 – 09;13;14;20
Jon
Decision and.

09;13;13;12 – 09;12;59;26
Nick “Cuts” 
And it’s it’s having that sounding board having, again, that community to be able to bounce back to, but knowing at the end of the day is my decision that I had to make. But having that community be like, Hey, is this a good idea, my am, I not.

09;12;59;16 – 09;12;54;05
Nick “Cuts” 
Am I morally right here? Am I mentally in the right frame of mind or do I need to check myself and readdress it?

09;12;53;20 – 09;12;49;03
Lindsey
Right? Are you too close to the situation? Type of thing to see it clearly or in different ways?

09;12;49;02 – 09;12;33;07
Nick “Cuts” 
Yeah, exactly that wise counsel. It’s incredibly important. You know, the first line is, you know, Lauren is the one I will always go to with my first set of problems and get that answer from her and her wisdom in in grace in handling those things is phenomenal.

09;12;31;26 – 09;12;18;21
Nick “Cuts” 
But there’s also the need to have seek even more counsel wise counsel. And that’s why I’ll reach out to you guys when there’s like things like, Hey, we’ve talked about this. I know she’s going to back me if I’m right.

09;12;18;20 – 09;12;04;14
Nick “Cuts” 
I want to make sure that not just us as a family unit is right. But is this right, as a collective, as a community? Would this be a right stance to hold? OK. OK, well executed. But ultimately it’s me executing right.

09;12;03;27 – 09;11;55;22
Lindsey
Yeah, it still falls to your decision, your choice. You’re going to be the one who’s going to be held accountable for what you say and do exactly.

09;11;55;10 – 09;11;33;08
Jon
There’s a transformation that happens when you start taking the level of responsibility. We’re talking about every step of greater responsibility and ownership over your own lives that we take, the greater sovereignty we have over our own lives. And one thing that I, you know, my memory is sparked differently having this type of conversation with you because we

09;11;33;08 – 09;11;20;17
Jon
walked so long together in like the situation you’re alluding to as you were in a military unit with a lot of corruption and you and you had convictions that didn’t allow that corruption to continue and you took the actions you felt were appropriate to address that.

09;11;20;07 – 09;11;01;12
Jon
And that took a lot of courage. And it could have cost you greatly career wise. And you know, here we are in your characters intact and you are stronger for it. And what I love about how you discussed the going to Lucy shout out, by the way, Lauren, your wife, she’s incredible and we love her.

09;11;01;04 – 09;10;38;20
Jon
But you know, having that respect cultivated in your marriage of I’m going to go to my better half my bride, the person, my beloved to gain their insight and making decisions I think is extremely positive. And then also going to that sounding board right wars are won in a multitude of wise counsel and, you know, gaining those

09;10;38;20 – 09;10;23;24
Jon
insights. To me, that’s something that someone who has sovereign ownership and control over the lives, they do that. And what I’m remembering is when I was a boy, I would want the same counsel so that I could learn from those perspectives.

09;10;23;14 – 09;10;04;01
Jon
But I also looked for the answer to my questions in the council, whereas now I have the answer typically, or I’ve made a decision typically to a certain level of fidelity, and I’m looking like you said to test it with the council, but I’m not looking for them to take ownership of the decision because I know that

09;10;04;01 – 09;09;48;01
Jon
that’s mine to make. And I think that that’s one of the shifts that happens when you start going from someone who looks for a parent or other to solve their problems to being one who like accepts the fact that it’s on them but still wants to make good decisions that are informed and tested.

09;09;47;15 – 09;09;30;19
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. And I think it goes, you know, I think it was a couple of one of the coffees and great, you guys did it. Where are you talking about with the boys right now, where you give them? They have a question, but you aren’t automatically giving them the answer.

09;09;30;19 – 09;09;16;10
Nick “Cuts” 
You’re like, Well, what do you think? Or where could you find these answers? And you’re teaching them to, Hey, I have this idea in my head. I think it’s right now. I go bounce and try to find the answers myself instead of just going to hitting the easy.

09;09;16;10 – 09;09;09;28
Nick “Cuts” 
But because the other pitfall that people fall into is, you’re going to always go to the people that you know are going to give you the answer you want to hear.

09;09;09;23 – 09;09;09;00
Nick “Cuts”
Right? Mhm.

09;09;08;20 – 09;08;57;23
Nick “Cuts” 
Right. Hey, I have this really hard decision in front of me. I know what I want to do, and it’s selfish, self seeking, self-serving. Who do I know within my?

09;08;56;23 – 09;08;56;00
Nick “Cuts”
Counsel.

09;08;55;10 – 09;08;40;24
Nick “Cuts” 
That’s going to back my decisions, and this is what we’re actually, you know, we see in society is a big hole. We have the the guys who guys and gals who get divorced and they have a divorce party with all of their single friends who are, yeah, that guy or that girl was a jerk.

09;08;40;24 – 09;08;21;06
Nick “Cuts” 
And I can’t know that that’s the exact wrong answer to have, because what you’re doing is you’re just commiserating and, you know, reinforcing negative behavior by seeking the easy counsel. Instead of seeking those wise, hard counselors, you are going to hold you accountable for your actions because what it’s doing is forcing it back onto you.

09;08;21;06 – 09;08;12;05
Nick “Cuts” 
A good counselor is going to be like, Hey. Are you sure that’s the decision you want to make? Is that really what you think or are you just wanting to hit the easy button on this one?

09;08;11;24 – 09;08;11;14
Nick “Cuts”
Mm-Hmm.

09;08;11;10 – 09;07;57;16
Jon
So when I think that’s the difference between choosing, like seeking confirmation, so you feel good about decision you knows wrong versus, you know, the type of people who are going to shoot straight and say, Nick, what are you doing?

09;07;57;16 – 09;07;57;03
Jon
That’s wrong?

09;07;56;11 – 09;07;56;00
Nick “Cuts”
Mm-Hmm.

09;07;55;13 – 09;07;49;20
Jon
And I think that’s another strength you. I think you cultivate and grow that right?

09;07;49;17 – 09;07;49;04
Lindsey
Yeah.

09;07;48;23 – 09;07;33;09
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. Because if you don’t, you’re you’re just doomed to repeat yourself. You’re going to go insane because it’s it’s uncomfortable to be uncomfortable, right? You don’t want to find those wise counselors that are going to hold you accountable because that means that you actually have to grow.

09;07;33;08 – 09;07;18;10
Nick “Cuts” 
That means you actually have to be like self-aware and be like, man. It’s not just everybody else around me that’s messed up. I got some stuff I got to fix, too, but that that in and of itself requires some wise counsel and self-awareness.

09;07;17;28 – 09;07;01;12
Nick “Cuts” 
And I think that that gets to the very core of Gray itself is if you aren’t self-aware and able to take mental faculty of your own shortcomings in your own inefficiencies and abilities, how can you expect yourself to be able to first grow, be able to love?

09;07;01;12 – 09;06;48;05
Nick “Cuts” 
Because if you don’t know yourself, you can’t love others, right? Loving neighbor as yourself. If you don’t even know yourself, how can you know somebody else? Truly? And in so doing, then you know the areas that you need somebody to hold you accountable on.

09;06;48;03 – 09;06;34;15
Nick “Cuts” 
You know who you need to go talk to when you’re, you know, for thinking through a math problem. I’m really I don’t know this math problem. I know this guy knows the math problem. He’s going to help teach me how to do the math problem instead of going to my calculator over here.

09;06;34;15 – 09;06;22;26
Nick “Cuts” 
That’s going to just give me and spit out the answer. You know, it’s seeking the desire to learn through your inequities instead of hitting the easy buddy and just getting rid of your inequities altogether.

09;06;21;28 – 09;06;07;13
Lindsey
Yeah, it’s exactly like you’re saying with the math thing. It’s like, I don’t go to the mechanic if my legs broken. I go to the doctor like exactly the right person. But it’s going to also be the uncomfortable one because if my legs broken and they have to reset it, that’s going to suck.

09;06;06;28 – 09;06;06;18
Nick “Cuts”
Mm-Hmm.

09;06;06;00 – 09;06;04;03
Jon
There’s there’s no other way about it.

09;06;03;07 – 09;05;56;27
Lindsey
But to get it back to where it needs to be, it has to be uncomfortable to force you to change.

09;05;56;08 – 09;05;54;28
Nick “Cuts” 
Yep, absolutely.

09;05;54;07 – 09;05;52;02
Jon
In along these lines, right? There’s this idea.

09;05;51;20 – 09;05;51;09
Nick “Cuts”
That.

09;05;50;18 – 09;05;41;28
Jon
Like there’s a saying something along the lines of if no one’s crazy in your family, then you’re the crazy one because every family has some crazy, right?

09;05;41;15 – 09;05;40;06
Nick “Cuts”
So like there.

09;05;39;26 – 09;05;38;08
Jon
There is this like big deal.

09;05;38;05 – 09;05;37;22
Nick “Cuts”
Where.

09;05;36;08 – 09;05;12;27
Jon
It’s uncomfortable. It’s hard work, but that’s the price you pay to have a higher quality life in which you can exercise sovereignty over your life, ownership of your life, enjoy the gifts of freedom and community. It comes at the price of looking in that mirror and taking account for who the heck you are and not trying to

09;05;12;27 – 09;04;54;25
Jon
get rid of. So this is something that I was just talking with Lindsey about. We were having a conversation, but for so long I’ve wanted to kill the bad and be right and feed the good right. There’s the old Native American proverb that in side of every man, there are two wolves, one that is good and one

09;04;54;25 – 09;04;42;24
Jon
that is evil, and the one that wins is the one you feed. And I think that’s true from where we are currently moving forward. But how about the animal that is part of you? Write that evil wolf, that’s part of you, that you said for years.

09;04;42;19 – 09;04;34;25
Jon
It’s still part of you. What do you do with it? Well, you can’t kill it. It’s part of you. So what do you do? You have to learn how to incorporate the good in the bad of who you are?

09;04;34;22 – 09;04;16;07
Jon
Your family was who your history is to create one unified picture that you can then use the strengths and shortcomings of to create a better today and tomorrow. And it’s through the incorporation of the brokenness, not the ignoring or the removing of it that you can actually build something powerful.

09;04;15;16 – 09;03;56;00
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. And you know, to to kind of expound on that, that context, the idea of the two walls. If you starve the snot out of something, what’s it going to want the moment that it gives any viability or any acknowledgment of it, if you don’t incorporate is a part of like, Hey, I know it’s short.

09;03;56;00 – 09;03;44;20
Nick “Cuts” 
I know this is something that I struggle with or I know that these are things that I am. I have a propensity to do. And you just deny, deny, deny, deny when it does finally rear its ugly head.

09;03;44;08 – 09;03;26;15
Nick “Cuts” 
It is going to be vicious. It’s going to be incredibly all consuming because it’s been starved for so long. And so you’ll see that it’s angry and you see that rebound and it comes out in manifests itself in a litany of different ways.

09;03;26;15 – 09;03;08;07
Nick “Cuts” 
You know, in relationships, it destroys marriages in and businesses it destroys partnerships. It’s. It is the pure thing that will destroy any good thing you’ve established, you got to recognize it in, like you said, incorporate it, not necessarily feed into it.

09;03;08;07 – 09;02;53;07
Nick “Cuts” 
Oh, hey, this is this is my plight. This is how I’m always going to be. But rather, hey, I know I do this. I see it. Hey, there’s a body or council. This is coming up. How do I interact with it?

09;02;53;07 – 09;02;49;28
Nick “Cuts” 
And those people help kind of drive you away from it?

09;02;48;02 – 09;02;34;09
Jon
Yeah. A really good, real, world grounded example of this, right that I think of is indicting, you know, sometimes people ask me like, Oh, what should I do or something? I’m like, No, you shouldn’t do it, you know?

09;02;33;04 – 09;02;14;20
Jon
The reason I believe that is because if you do a diet, what happens when most people do a diet? If you do a 30 day strict diet, then when you’re done with that diet, you celebrate, right? Yep. And then in three days, you’ve undone the 30 days progress because those habits, those parts of how you consume food

09;02;14;11 – 09;02;07;02
Jon
weren’t addressed. You just suffocated them and they got hung. They got those urges, got stronger and stronger. And still, hey, I just did.

09;02;07;02 – 09;02;04;20
Nick “Cuts”
Great for 30 days. Celebrate.

09;02;04;07 – 09;01;46;01
Jon
Let’s eat all the cheesecake and pudding. And next thing you know you’re Adobe and sloppy and gross again. And the the difference is, though. So like, that’s that whole cycle of like if I have this part of me that is like, really not good or I’m not happy with and I just try to suppress it and ignore

09;01;46;01 – 09;01;31;22
Jon
it and pretend like it’s not there, then when it breaks free from that restraint one week, it’s going to wreak havoc on my life. It’s a different approach is to say, OK, how can I learn from these negative habits?

09;01;31;14 – 09;01;14;22
Jon
You know these negative things and have them become a part of my lifestyle in a way that you. Is healthy and stronger, right? And that’s where, like on the diet conversation, I I’ll just ask. OK, well, to get started changing lifestyle, how much water to drink?

09;01;14;00 – 09;01;04;10
Jon
Let’s just start with that. Do you drink near a gallon a day? No. Just focus on that for the next month until you don’t even think about it and you’re doing it. And then let’s talk about the next step.

09;01;04;10 – 09;01;00;04
Jon
And it’s not going to be sexy. It’s not going to be fast. But by doing things like.

09;01;00;04 – 09;00;56;26
Lindsey
That, but it’s a lifestyle change. It’s not a diet.

09;00;56;25 – 09;00;55;19
Jon
That’s it. You’re changing.

09;00;55;19 – 09;00;55;00
Nick “Cuts”
Lifestyle.

09;00;54;21 – 09;00;38;28
Lindsey
Yeah. And that takes time to undo the bad behavior of the small choices that you make day in and day out when you’re weak, when you don’t have someone going next to you and alongside you and developing good habits.

09;00;38;20 – 09;00;27;25
Lindsey
So you have to develop the good habit with one thing specifically within the diet before you can even attempt to go well, I’m going to eat all vegetables. I’m going to cut all this out and I’m going to drink a gallon of water.

09;00;27;20 – 09;00;27;11
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah.

09;00;26;12 – 09;00;10;24
Nick “Cuts” 
Exactly. It’s the slow, steady, slow the turtle wins the race. Slow and steady wins the race. You know you can go fast, and that’s great. Some people are meant in designed and incapable of doing those things, and that’s their journey.

09;00;10;24 – 10;59;54;11
Nick “Cuts” 
That’s their life. The vast majority of people slow and steady, and it’s a generational thing. You know, it’s not going to happen in one generation. Sometimes it may take two generations for things to change for even in a family.

10;59;54;11 – 10;59;33;20
Nick “Cuts” 
Sometimes it takes some whole and generation to pull a family out of poverty, and then it takes a whole nother generation to develop some wealth, and then it takes another generation to actually sustain that wealth. And so it’s it’s not just in in we as we as people want to have that instantaneous, especially here in America, that

10;59;33;20 – 10;59;11;07
Nick “Cuts” 
instant change the pill that fixes it all the this, you know, this surgery that’s going to change this, this program diet, what have you. It’s all to try to get the clickbait because people want that instant gratification instead of seeing the long term payout of being diligent, deliberate and and methodical about the way in which they approach

10;59;11;07 – 10;58;53;22
Nick “Cuts” 
problem sets. Because anybody can do hard things. Everybody can do hard things. It’s just at what point are you interacting with those hard things or are you starting at ground zero? Have no capability of coping mechanisms, and you’re just going to find your way through it or you kind of the middle where you’re like, Hey, I know

10;58;53;22 – 10;58;42;27
Nick “Cuts” 
how to kind of interact with this, but I have it developed because I haven’t chose to develop. Are you at the higher end where it’s like, Hey, this is going to be hard, it’s going to suck. But I got to get through this 26 miles.

10;58;42;27 – 10;58;28;22
Nick “Cuts” 
I got to get through that twelve mile run. I got to get through a week of a fussy baby who’s got a cold. I got it. But I have the mental resiliency of the emotional resiliency and maturity to interact at those different levels.

10;58;28;22 – 10;58;18;10
Nick “Cuts” 
And that’s harking back to which you guys are saying it doesn’t. It’s not just a day today I decide I’m going to change. No, it’s it’s the systematic changing as you go along in life.

10;58;16;11 – 10;58;15;13
Lindsey
Well, it really is.

10;58;14;25 – 10;58;08;16
Jon
In something that happens to talking about the turtle, the tortoise and the hare, right, you got to go slow and steady and then some people turn on.

10;58;08;16 – 10;58;08;04
Nick “Cuts” 
Their.

10;58;07;24 – 10;58;06;27
Jon
You know, the turd in the hair.

10;58;06;17 – 10;58;06;03
Nick “Cuts”
Well, no.

10;58;05;27 – 10;58;05;18
Jon
I haven’t.

10;58;05;16 – 10;57;57;10
Nick “Cuts”
Heard. Yeah, right. Just last year, a twelve year old boys.

10;57;57;10 – 10;57;56;06
Nick “Cuts” 
At three year old bodies.

10;57;56;00 – 10;57;55;03
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah, exactly.

10;57;55;03 – 10;57;36;07
Jon
But the fun thing, though, is I remember the only time I felt a desperation as a parent in what am I going to do with this child from the stress of like becoming a father was with Jeremiah when he was very, very young, like a couple of months old, and I couldn’t get him to stop crying.

10;57;36;07 – 10;57;23;07
Jon
And, you know, life was very full for both Lindsey and I. She was handling some responsibilities. I was being a father, caring for my son. And I could not hear calling. I could not get him to stop crying, and it drove me to the point I had to set him down.

10;57;23;06 – 10;57;10;24
Jon
I sat down on the ground. I set him next to me because I was losing my mind and I just like sat there with my head in my hands trying to get a grasp on stuff and just kind of calm down because it’s very Adobe.

10;57;10;24 – 10;57;04;19
Jon
If you’ve not been in that experience, it’s very if you have and you’ve never felt like that, then you’re a saint or you’re lying.

10;57;04;06 – 10;57;03;05
Nick “Cuts”
And yeah.

10;57;03;05 – 10;57;02;18
Nick “Cuts” 
Exactly.

10;57;01;26 – 10;56;47;15
Jon
And like. But in that, that was the only time I’ve been. We’ve had two in our four boys and all of them at once losing their minds. I’ve never felt that level of craziness again. But in that moment, as a sitting there, I just took a few deep breaths and was like, Well, you can’t care for himself

10;56;47;15 – 10;56;31;13
Jon
. This is on me. You know, when there’s responsibility things, what can I do? And if nothing can be done, what can I do to prepare for when something changes in this and kind of gathered just enough to get back in the fight with a level head and not be afraid of, like losing my frustration, right?

10;56;31;03 – 10;56;27;02
Jon
Because that’s what happens when when that happens, you start shaking kids and stuff, and that’s a real thing.

10;56;26;13 – 10;56;26;03
Nick “Cuts”
And.

10;56;25;20 – 10;56;10;20
Jon
Just got that discipline back and picked him up and did what I could. And and it worked out right. But there’s those moments where you have to rise with extraordinary effort to something. But then over time, what did cost you almost everything to do earlier on costs you very little to maintain.

10;56;10;13 – 10;55;54;09
Jon
So that’s kind of a cool aspect of it. But then the other thing is, I think as a life rhythm, it should be slow and steady. But there’s times where the tortoise has to become a hair and really go right, and there may be seasons and bursts of now’s the time to sprint and go lightning fast.

10;55;53;22 – 10;55;52;08
Jon
But I need to fall back.

10;55;52;08 – 10;55;36;13
Lindsey
Even on the other aspect of the the hare has to stop and rest a lot. But the tortoise just gets to keep going. Yeah. So like, I think that even not even necessarily having to sprint, but you’re choosing just to keep going and pushing through it where the the hare has to stop because it’s gone too fast

10;55;36;13 – 10;55;21;11
Lindsey
for too long. And so that’s where that leg of the journey is, is one because the tortoise never had to stop. So when he just gets to keep going, it’s like that sprint. And I think that’s really like where it hatches itself out.

10;55;21;11 – 10;55;17;07
Lindsey
The tortoise never stops, though. He doesn’t have to stop to rest.

10;55;16;12 – 10;55;02;06
Nick “Cuts” 
Exactly. And in your in the hare, you’re right. It’s the that’s where you see people have their burnouts, they have their midlife crisis, they have this crisis, they have that crisis. It’s because they’re their go, go, go, go, go and.

10;55;00;14 – 10;54;44;00
Nick “Cuts” 
High intensity all the time, and there are some people who thrive in that, and that’s their way. But those those weight makers in that sense in those regards are far and few in between everybody. The most most people, like we say, is we we hit those points.

10;54;44;00 – 10;54;22;29
Nick “Cuts” 
Those high points were, yeah, jeremiad that. Look, I haven’t had that with Gray yet. He’s had a couple of times where he’s. Chrises, little fool head off for about two minutes, and then he’s done, gives the party lip and falls asleep, but there are moments where it’s like in that moment you’re like, OK, this will pass.

10;54;22;29 – 10;54;10;16
Nick “Cuts” 
This too shall pass. We can get through this. It’s tough. You got to get up for it. But the next time it comes along, it’s like, well, the last time wasn’t as bad as I made it, because I think that’s the other thing is we start gaining our heads about these things.

10;54;10;16 – 10;53;46;22
Nick “Cuts” 
We start giving an hour in seeing our inequities in those moments and we go down to the base level, like you said before, and that becomes our. Well, we start to dwell on instead of drawing on the positive of, hey, he’s yelling, he’s screaming, he’s able to do these things that are amazing and miracles in and of

10;53;46;22 – 10;53;33;03
Nick “Cuts” 
themselves. Like, I think that was the first thing hearing Gray scream when he first came out and hearing him crying, it was like. I wanted to comfort him because we all think crying is a bad thing, but the nurses look to me like, No, it’s OK.

10;53;32;26 – 10;53;17;14
Nick “Cuts” 
We need him to cry. It’s good for him to cry right now. That is so good and I’m like, Oh my gosh, like, this is this is like, this is human. Like, that’s that’s what we do. So it’s it will pass, but it’s those moments of, you’re right.

10;53;17;06 – 10;53;02;04
Nick “Cuts” 
You got a girl. Gird your shrink. But because you’ve built up over time. That’s that sustained ability. Those short spikes aren’t as dramatic as not even during the journey at all. Right?

10;52;59;04 – 10;52;47;26
Jon
Yeah, and one of the things like for you with Gray specifically, I think’s a huge benefit is you’ve walked a lot more life and matured and you’ve added a lot of tools and resilience to your toolkit. You’ve taken ownership of your life.

10;52;47;17 – 10;52;36;07
Jon
You’ve had a lot of trials you’ve walked through. So I don’t think like what my experience was universal for parents. I mean, you’re a grown man with the maturity of a man who has sovereignty over their life with this boy.

10;52;36;00 – 10;52;34;02
Jon
I was a child when Jeremiah was born.

10;52;34;01 – 10;52;33;19
Nick “Cuts” 
Yeah.

10;52;33;01 – 10;52;27;11
Jon
He was part of my forced evolution to becoming a man. So that was a little different.

10;52;27;02 – 10;52;22;28
Lindsey
I had no interaction with a baby before Jeremiah.

10;52;22;15 – 10;52;20;24
Nick “Cuts”
Yeah, that was just.

10;52;20;13 – 10;52;19;23
Lindsey
Different.

10;52;19;14 – 10;52;18;16
Nick “Cuts”
Don’t you?

10;52;17;26 – 10;52;11;00
Nick “Cuts” 
You’re a baby raising a baby. I mean, that’s genuinely where you guys were and. All power to you guys.

10;52;10;26 – 10;52;07;19
Nick “Cuts”
I wish it was, and.

10;52;06;18 – 10;51;55;29
Nick “Cuts” 
I was glad I was there to help support and love and cherish with you all that that was that was rough to get through, but you guys got through it, you know, and you guys are stronger for it.

10;51;55;24 – 10;51;42;03
Nick “Cuts” 
And when you guys become grandparents down the road, you guys are going to be even better for it because you can help your boys through it just like, you know, mom and dad did with you guys and what your parents did, they were there to help in that support role.

10;51;41;16 – 10;51;35;22
Nick “Cuts” 
You guys now know what that looks like and how to help if they decide to have little ones when their babies to.

10;51;35;12 – 10;51;32;11
Jon
And and not and how not to help, too.

10;51;32;11 – 10;51;31;26
Nick “Cuts”
Sometimes.

10;51;31;06 – 10;51;15;23
Jon
You’ve mentioned a couple of times. Nick, I’m going to just call it cuts because it’s more comfortable for me. But I don’t know. I mean, it’s so weird. But you mentioned a couple of times with the tortoise and the hare example, like some people are just like hares and they thrive in that.

10;51;15;23 – 10;51;05;26
Jon
And that’s good for them. And I was I was thinking about that, and I really think it’s not true. I think the perception is that they’re hares, but I really think they’re just high capacity turtles.

10;51;05;05 – 10;51;02;12
Nick “Cuts”
Be kind of OK because because.

10;51;02;12 – 10;51;00;26
Jon
From the outside looking in their.

10;51;00;26 – 10;50;58;28
Lindsey
Sea turtles, they swim fast and they they’re.

10;50;58;28 – 10;50;54;07
Jon
Swimming. You know, I love how we are really beating this metaphor to death.

10;50;53;25 – 10;50;53;11
Nick “Cuts”
But yeah.

10;50;52;28 – 10;50;38;24
Jon
But I was just thinking about this. Like when I think of all the high capacity people I know, they’ve built lifestyles that support the output that they’re doing, but that also like if you really look at them. one example is like Jocko Willink or another Elon Musk.

10;50;38;24 – 10;50;34;08
Jon
He’s talked about this a lot with his his family now because he lost his first family from its stakes. And this.

10;50;33;16 – 10;50;32;25
Nick “Cuts”
Is the.

10;50;32;24 – 10;50;09;13
Jon
All these people have. Stiffly protected rhythms in their life to recharge, refuel, reconnect with those around them and to manage the priorities that they’re investing themselves in. And then they do, then they invest their energy in those priorities and from the outside looking in, it’s like, how do you do a business and write books and do this

10;50;09;13 – 10;49;55;17
Jon
and do that? And it seems like they’re just high capacity hairs that never stop. But in reality, when you pull the engine back and talk with them over their life, they’ve developed a life style that allows them to have high capacity.

10;49;55;09 – 10;49;36;21
Jon
But they’re still for them, going methodically forward. And it’s the difference of having, you know, a boy like a baby raising a baby versus someone who has the moral character and resilience to handle extraordinarily painful, difficult, stressful things be given a child.

10;49;36;21 – 10;49;16;16
Jon
There’s still adjustments. But the difference in your capacity becoming a father now compared to mine when I was 20 is very, very different. And I think that capacity is what changes. And if you know that and when we look at those people who are really thriving, it’s like, OK, well, how have they made this lifestyle work for

10;49;16;16 – 10;49;06;28
Jon
them? And you know? What path does it take to get there for myself? Hmm. Yeah, as an idea to build that high capacity turtle idea?

10;49;05;02 – 10;49;04;18
Nick “Cuts”
Mm hmm. Yeah.

10;49;04;07 – 10;48;47;15
Jon
And frankly, really shortly, that’s what I’m seeing with these, these contracts I’m doing right. They start as like 25, 30 day things, and now I’m really liking the triple digits and I’m aiming them. As I’ve learned to incorporate the piece of myself, I didn’t like into my life in a way that’s healthier.

10;48;47;03 – 10;48;34;07
Jon
I’m aiming them to create the best version of life I want to live, but that I don’t think I’ve disciplined to necessarily do otherwise yet. And that’s creating that resource to hopefully do more over time. And who knows?

10;48;34;06 – 10;48;33;08
Jon
But what do you think of that?

10;48;30;10 – 10;48;08;27
Nick “Cuts” 
I think high capacity turtles. Yeah, I guess I see what you’re saying in that regard. I take it back to like the safe communities, right? The Ranger regiments and things like that. You know, there’s individuals within those organizations who.

10;48;07;09 – 10;47;49;27
Nick “Cuts” 
They are I mean, if you want to call them a high capacity turtle, I mean, those guys are like sting and got robo whatever to keep going the way they do. But they you’ll see, at least on the officer side, I’ve seen and not Jordan, but some of the other ones that I’ve seen, they hit terminal velocity

10;47;49;27 – 10;47;33;04
Nick “Cuts” 
and they just burn out. But they were high chargers, high fast movers, and they had built a system. And it looks like it was sustainable. And then just one thing derails it, right? one little thing derailed the entire architecture they establish.

10;47;33;04 – 10;47;12;21
Nick “Cuts” 
They get injured, they blow neon Iraq, they whatever. And all of a sudden, they’re back to ground zero and they have no ability to go forward anymore because they’ve lost their identity, they’ve lost who they are they they don’t have those things built in outside of just that pursuit.

10;47;11;26 – 10;46;54;29
Nick “Cuts” 
Hmm. So that’s where I’m talking. I guess that’s to differentiate delineate between the two. That’s the high, high performers I’m talking about that are the the hairs. And that doesn’t they they’re going going, going, going. And then something hits and derails them and they’re unable to continue forward.

10;46;54;09 – 10;46;43;21
Jon
That’s fair. And I think that’s fair like, well, how can you tell these high performers who are going at the speed of light, right, comparative to what our perception is? How can you tell if they’re a hair or if they’re a high capacity turtle?

10;46;43;04 – 10;46;29;03
Jon
And I think that’s what let’s look at the things that they’re being resilient through and kind of let’s judge them by their fruit right over time because, like the dude suggested, are getting punched in the face and life is falling apart and they’re still going.

10;46;28;25 – 10;46;21;04
Jon
It’s like, that is someone who has built the systems to not stop and they have that resilience. Those are the high capacity turtles.

10;46;20;25 – 10;46;19;28
Nick “Cuts” 
High capacity turtles.

10;46;19;28 – 10;46;05;03
Jon
Yeah, yeah. And then the guys who are super high speed. But like you said, something happens and everything falls apart. Those are the guys who are the hackers who are just going to burn out and then hopefully they can build something with greater longevity out of that.

10;46;04;26 – 10;45;49;00
Jon
But. And the other thing too is I think that every I don’t know, that’s not true. My experience was I was someone who was more hit terminal velocity and burnout, and I got sick of burning out and wanted to figure out, how can I go without burnout?

10;45;48;19 – 10;45;48;05
Nick “Cuts”
Right?

10;45;47;25 – 10;45;46;03
Jon
And that’s the experiment now.

10;45;45;25 – 10;45;24;24
Nick “Cuts” 
You know? Yeah. Well, and but you did have systems and processes in place because you continue forward instead of sitting in. You’ll love our veteran community, but there are some out there that it will be the guy that back in my day and they’re sitting there haven’t really done much with their life, have not progressed forward and

10;45;24;10 – 10;45;13;01
Nick “Cuts” 
that’s their journey. That’s what they wanted to do. But then they make it out. It’s wrong. Yeah, exactly. They chose to stagnate at that point instead of, Hey, you know what? My time in service was over. I need to move on.

10;45;13;00 – 10;44;56;02
Nick “Cuts” 
Sure, I can have this great memories and and talk about it and enjoy that. But now it’s time to move on to the next chapter, it’s time to move on, to the next big thing to to go forward instead of just being stagnant, and that is who I was, was who I am and will always be, and

10;44;56;02 – 10;44;52;04
Nick “Cuts” 
I will not be any greater than I was at this one individual snapshot in life.

10;44;51;26 – 10;44;36;22
Jon
And how sad is that like? I think it’s less common now, but I think of like the letterman jacket dudes who are 40 years old and they’re pulling up to a letterman jacket to go to a reunion and it’s like we’re meant to live any evolve continuously.

10;44;36;04 – 10;44;34;14
Jon
Right? Not it doesn’t stop.

10;44;33;16 – 10;44;32;23
Nick “Cuts”
It doesn’t stop.

10;44;32;11 – 10;44;15;13
Nick “Cuts” 
No, and it’s great. I mean, it’s great to to have those memories and sure. If I had a Leatherman jack in wanting to go back to my reunion. Absolutely. But I’m going back, not as that guy, but as the Hey, this allow me to do X, Y and Z.

10;44;15;04 – 10;43;57;17
Nick “Cuts” 
This was a stepping stone and this is great and I want to interact and see my old friends. But time to move on. Right? It’s not. That’s not solely who I am, though it may not even that Jackie may not even be viable anymore because it’s sat in a closet somewhere for 1020 years and falling apart.

10;43;57;12 – 10;43;56;29
Nick “Cuts” 
So.

10;43;56;11 – 10;43;39;09
Jon
Yeah, and that’s just part of it, right? Like, there’s times when the transitions happen that you have to, I think, just suck it up and wait for the time to get some clarity and keep driving on. And then you also can never let yourself have the excuse of stop learning and developing like we always have to keep

10;43;39;09 – 10;43;38;27
Jon
going.

10;43;38;11 – 10;43;16;22
Nick “Cuts” 
Absolutely. And that’s the we. We are meant to seek answers. We are meant to gain knowledge and grow and continue to seek after the mystery that is God in his creation, his plans. And you know, it’s we have purpose that drives us forward.

10;43;16;06 – 10;42;55;12
Nick “Cuts” 
You know, but that ultimately we’re. Designed to be curious and the moment that you’re stopping curious other you’re dead and all of the answers have been provided you or you’ve just stagnated and you’re no longer a contributing functioning member of a family or society.