EXPLORING THE TOOLS THAT UNLEASH HUMAN POTENTIAL
Episode 39 from The Grit Theory.
Today Lindsey and I sit down with Nick Hurff, a Army Veteran, adventurist, sports performance and exercise science professional.
Highlights include:
-Wanting to become better.
-Evaluate your values.
-Being present today.
-Autonomy between attainment and attunement.
-How to start adding adventure to your life.
Did you find value in today’s conversation? SHARE IT!
Also, check out Be Relentless: If the obstacle is the way, then we must be waymakers HERE.
Do you want to learn more? Check out:
The Book: Be Relentless: If the obstacle is the way, then we must be WayMakers.
The Podcast: “Be Relentless Podcast”
The Fuel: Sisu Stamina, Performance Evolved
Linktree: Here.
00;00;08;28 – 00;00;32;27
Jon Mayo
Hello. Great theory. Today we have the opportunity with Lindsey and myself to sit down with Nicholas Hirsch, who goes by Nick, if I’m not entirely mistaken. But am I glad I’m not missing yet? That’s fine. That’s good. And yeah, so Jeremy so Ben recommended that we sit down and have a conversation. He said that you’re essentially a God man.
00;00;32;27 – 00;00;52;29
Jon Mayo
You all met each other in the service and that we would benefit from talking about living intentionally and cultivating courage, bravery and determination and living this life fully. So figured we’d sit down and pick your brain, see if I could make you uncomfortable in the first 60 seconds or not, and go from there. How did you.
00;00;52;29 – 00;00;59;09
Nick Hurff
You had a pretty pretty spot on with uncomfortable now.
00;00;59;09 – 00;00;59;18
Jon Mayo
Yeah.
00;01;00;16 – 00;01;23;20
Nick Hurff
Jeremiah and I met at triple C so the captains career, of course. But in back in 2017 and then pretty much we were workout partners for the entire time for about I guess about seven six months. And you know, Jeremiah’s a couple of years older than me, five, five years older than me or so. So we kind of learned he was able to mentor me a little bit there.
00;01;23;20 – 00;01;39;01
Nick Hurff
And we had a lot of great conversations. Specifically, we do a lot of ten mile runs every Friday, and that was a good time that we were, you know, in between huffing and puffing, would have a lot of deep conversations and really good times right along the Chattahoochee River Walk.
00;01;39;01 – 00;02;02;02
Jon Mayo
So that’s good. That’s cool. That’s fine. I love the types of philosophical conversations you can have when you’re in like excruciating pain. It’s just a different type of conversation. It really is. So let’s go back a little bit further. What, so you decided to serve in the Army, correct? What? So why that versus like jumping straight into the studio sector?
00;02;02;02 – 00;02;24;06
Jon Mayo
And then I know you’ve served for a while you met Jeremiah specifically at Captains Career Course and you guys did that type of jazz. You continued serving for a bit and then now you’re out doing sports performance and exercise science work. So just kind of the broad spectrum. Why that path? What what made you want to pull the strings and let’s go from there.
00;02;25;02 – 00;02;35;18
Nick Hurff
Yeah, I think I just kind of went out. So when I was little, I actually met one of my uncle’s friends, use a Navy SEAL, and I was like, I don’t know, I was probably eight and I saw.
00;02;35;18 – 00;02;35;28
Jon Mayo
A.
00;02;36;23 – 00;02;54;05
Nick Hurff
Documentary on the History Channel or something on that. So I thought that was awesome. So then I was a little kid with, you know, one of four boys and we just play army in the woods and go fishing and all kinds of stuff in the woods all the time. And that was just kind of something in the back of my mind growing up.
00;02;54;16 – 00;03;12;03
Nick Hurff
So I kind of knew I wanted to serve. And then especially with our generation, you know, the words were going on and all that. So it was definitely kind of something I wanted to do. And then the route that I specifically took, I was looking at maybe enlisting actually at one point and was really kind of pushed pursuing that.
00;03;12;03 – 00;03;31;29
Nick Hurff
And my older cousin, he was a officer in the Coast Guard, so he was like, Hey, have you looked at the ROTC program? No idea. So I looked into it. I was playing competitive soccer at that time, so I had opportunities to play at some level, all college soccer teams like Division three levels and, you know, kind of worked out.
00;03;31;29 – 00;03;48;22
Nick Hurff
I got the scholarship, had a lot of schools I could play at that offered ROTC. So it was really a free ride to college. And I got to continue playing soccer, which was fun. And then after, you know, got to serve. So I kind of went that route while I was in ROTC. We had a pretty good program.
00;03;49;18 – 00;04;08;17
Nick Hurff
We had a captain who was a Ranger pal and Ranger company commander kind of guy. And then we had a special Forces major. So it was very combat arms focused, which is what I liked, and that’s kind of where I wanted to go. So there’s a lot of development there and, you know, branched infantry and went that whole over out.
00;04;08;17 – 00;04;23;22
Jon Mayo
So yeah, well, that does summarize it pretty well. Yeah. And then you separate. Yeah, Yeah. So that brings you back up to meeting Jeremie Sylvan and then you stayed in for a bit longer, correct?
00;04;25;08 – 00;04;48;01
Nick Hurff
Yeah. So I stayed in for about eight years. So I was a platoon leader at, up at Fort Drum. So prior to that, did the whole Ranger Airborne kind of thing at Benning, the infantry platoon leader, for almost two years, we did a nine month deployment. We were in my platoon was split in five locations. We were with Special Forces odisha’s all around the country.
00;04;48;19 – 00;05;07;07
Nick Hurff
So I was with the largest element down in Helmand. I had another element that was out of Bath. They got to get in a lot of stuff up in Kunduz. Another group was out a mess. They were in Badakhshan a lot. And then another one was a camp integrity and all four location. Pretty much my entire platoon for the most part, got kids.
00;05;07;18 – 00;05;31;04
Nick Hurff
We had seven Valor awards and like things got pretty hairy, which was interesting at the time. So was in 2015 to 2016 when we first showed up. Nothing’s going on. And then by the end, you know, we were doing operations and everything else and pretty intense deployment. So then from there was a company, XO for a year and which is great.
00;05;31;04 – 00;05;51;01
Nick Hurff
I had an excellent company commander. He was an old school enlisted guy. He was a news analyst. He’s like E-5, Ranger tab sniper guy, had a lot of combat deployments. He had valor ward themselves as very combat focused, which I like coming out of that kind of mindset with the deployment. And that made me want to stay in at least be a company commander.
00;05;51;17 – 00;06;01;08
Nick Hurff
And so I stayed in that route and went to triple C. From there I went to the Asymmetric Warfare Group for a bit, which was great. I was probably the youngest.
00;06;01;22 – 00;06;02;15
Jon Mayo
Guy in.
00;06;02;15 – 00;06;27;28
Nick Hurff
The unit besides like the combat people and half the unit civilian contractors. They were all soft backgrounds. So I was kind of the the little fish in the big pond and the guys that’s with, you know, one point we did LPD that one of the guys in the unit ran and you know his guys he every day and he was one of the guys that was in, you know Operation Eagle Claw over and you know, I ran years ago.
00;06;28;07 – 00;06;46;23
Nick Hurff
So he’s in his 70 I think in just that kind of level of, you know, your CAG Delta operator guys that are top notch or they’re working next to you. It’s just something that you learn a lot off of, which is awesome. So I learned a ton. They’re more developed mentally and then from there I was only there about a year.
00;06;46;23 – 00;07;02;05
Nick Hurff
I got out and went to do Company Command Bliss, so we kind of had our choice of where we wanted to go. We chose Bliss because at the time I wanted to go to Ranger Regiment, and then over two years at Bliss, we kind of started reevaluate kind of values in life and what whatnot. I want to have kids and all.
00;07;02;05 – 00;07;09;01
Nick Hurff
And we made the decision to to leave the service. So but it was a good time while we were in.
00;07;09;01 – 00;07;20;04
Jon Mayo
Okay. Yeah. Real quick for the for the audience. So a KBE is a combat infantry badge SOF as the Special Operations Forces community and helped is leadership personal development.
00;07;20;14 – 00;07;26;20
Lindsey Mayo
You’re fine. We both know what you’re talking about. Yeah, I know most people who listen to our show well, not boast, but a good portion probably.
00;07;26;20 – 00;07;50;11
Jon Mayo
Don’t probably down. So we’re just a pepper the the steak with explain the acronyms as we go. Now what’s wild and you just like brush past some pretty I imagine hearing experiences through your career and that’s all good and well but one of the things that I picked up on is you seem to run into these decision points, right?
00;07;50;19 – 00;08;10;07
Jon Mayo
You learned about ROTC, you go that path, you’re drawn to something in the combat arms, you go that path, you keep having these opportunities to take the next step up and pursue a higher level of performance. At least I know that based on the the reputation of the organizations and the types of things you were pursuing and doing, Yeah.
00;08;10;09 – 00;08;24;23
Jon Mayo
What what caused you to want to continue to hone and refine your craft and go for an echelon higher in performance as opposed to, you know, just staying where you’re at and serving your time and having fun? Yeah, I.
00;08;24;23 – 00;08;25;09
Nick Hurff
Think it’s.
00;08;26;18 – 00;08;26;25
Jon Mayo
A lot.
00;08;26;25 – 00;08;47;11
Nick Hurff
Of it’s just wanting to be better. So I think it’s kind of self-development of, you know, if I can become better as a person or as whatever my craft is, you know, kind of honing those in, I feel pride in that and I feel good about it. Whereas, you know, I feel if I’m stagnant, it’s not as it’s not useful, I guess is the best way to put it.
00;08;47;22 – 00;09;12;24
Nick Hurff
So I feel more fulfilled when I’m pursuing kind of pushing myself in different areas and trying to get better. I don’t like to really stay stagnant. And when it comes to, you know, I guess a big thing would be in the Army career is very focused on kind of the combat side and wanting to excel there with like being a leader and and kind of working that So when the opportunity came up for AWG, I thought that be a great way to go.
00;09;12;24 – 00;09;33;15
Nick Hurff
So I applied, went through the little selection thing they did and it went well and you know, I had that opportunity. So it’s sometimes, you know, intimidating to know that you’re going into somewhere where you’re going to be kind of, you know, the small fish in the big pond, as I say. But at the same time, it’s an opportunity to grow.
00;09;33;24 – 00;09;52;02
Nick Hurff
So I think being able to take opportunities, even though you may fail at something, quote unquote, you know, if you even want to term it that way or maybe not excel compared to others around you, just kind of makes you grow more. So that’s kind of a big, big thing that of one way that I kind of view the life, I guess.
00;09;54;05 – 00;10;14;03
Jon Mayo
That’s fair to how you can do it, because I think things the same way. We both are looking for ways to grow pretty consistently. Well, I found you really have to develop like a habit and triggers to notice when you’re not right, when you’re starting to stagnate and begin looking for ways into it. What what’s that look like for you?
00;10;14;03 – 00;10;36;12
Jon Mayo
So like in the military, the decision points are kind of baked in, right? And you have the ability to pursue along the way. So that makes sense. So you you serve your time, you get a good amount of experience deployed. You go to the Advanced Warfare Group, you continue from there. And then you mentioned we and I’m assuming you’re referencing your wife and you yourself.
00;10;36;26 – 00;11;03;11
Jon Mayo
Correct. Okay. Entering into that, correct? Correct. Or so you begin to look at life in question like, Hey, we’re here at Durham, we’re looking at going into Ranger Regiment, which is where Jeremiah Sullivan pulled a lot of his experience from. And now we’re starting to question our our motives and intent in our intent. But the next couple of years of her life and and looking at maybe some trajectory changes.
00;11;03;24 – 00;11;28;17
Jon Mayo
So being one who’s continuing to pursue the next level. Right? Yeah. How did that fit in with the conversations and decisions you made with your wife on Let’s Leave a Career where by everything you’ve just said, you’re advancing swiftly, You’re a rising star, you have no reason to leave professionally. What what fit into that thought process? Yeah, that’s that’s great.
00;11;28;17 – 00;11;46;29
Nick Hurff
So there’s kind of a lot of stuff there. But I guess one thing is just kind of evaluating your values, you know, and that’s kind of a big thing. So I do a values exercise every year or so, and I like to do a kind of when life changes, right? So whenever there’s kind of a life change, we move, we peaks.
00;11;46;29 – 00;11;59;05
Nick Hurff
That’s kind of where we dig into it again or if we’re coming up on a big decision. So it’s a simple exercise. It’s just it’s from this book called Maximal Climbing by Eric Horst. So he’s like big in the rock climbing community and.
00;11;59;05 – 00;11;59;29
Jon Mayo
Frame of reference.
00;12;01;01 – 00;12;02;01
Nick Hurff
Maximal, climbing.
00;12;02;13 – 00;12;03;12
Jon Mayo
Maximal. Thank you.
00;12;03;24 – 00;12;27;13
Nick Hurff
Yeah. And that’s great for non rock climbers, too. There’s a lot of it’s a lot of sports and performance psychology and things like that baked into it, which are great for anybody and kind of adventurous, high consequential environments. So anyway, it’s just a highlight 15 things and you can substitute or whatnot and you just kind of list them in order from 1 to 15 on what you think are most of value to you.
00;12;27;22 – 00;12;54;07
Nick Hurff
And some people break it up into like personal ideals versus values depending on how you you work it. But he uses values as it’s I call it a values exercise and just kind of really evaluating that and where we want to go kind of changed it. So we knew we wanted to have family. And when I was at all this, I started this three shop, you know, which is always a grind, and then went down the company command.
00;12;54;07 – 00;13;21;20
Nick Hurff
But one of the big things was the guys next to me. You know, we’re working, you know, we’re there at 6 a.m. in the morning and we’re there 8 p.m. at night. And you know, my one buddy, he’s he would see his kids go to bed at night and then he would leave before he even woke up. So, like, he really didn’t see them until Friday night when we’d get off a little early and he got pizza with them and he put them to bed Sunday night and then he wouldn’t really see them again the rest of the week.
00;13;22;01 – 00;13;42;12
Nick Hurff
And then I was looking at the majors above us, and they’re even working Saturdays and Sundays and just grinding and grinding. Plus you can see, you can see the you can see them age in front of you over the months as well. And I’m just like, What are we doing? And coming kind of from that background with, you know, combat deployment where we got to get into some stuff which is good.
00;13;42;12 – 00;13;57;07
Nick Hurff
And it was kind of the mindset that I came from with the world of that and looking at how kind of over eight years seeing the changes in the Army is just, you know, if I stay in and there’s going to be a lot of I’m going to be a major and I’m going to be filling their roles and I’m going to be having kids.
00;13;57;19 – 00;14;22;21
Nick Hurff
And I just don’t want to I don’t want to have that as I don’t want to raise kids that way, I guess, is the big thing. So at the same time, too, I know that as we’re going up, combat deployments are going down, they’ve ceased now. And just kind of looking at where it is, I don’t see it being as fulfilling there, given the consequences of decisions to stay in and everything else that, you know, would be kind of the what I’m missing on.
00;14;22;24 – 00;14;44;05
Nick Hurff
I don’t think you kind of fit in with where the values were that I wanted to go and my wife felt the same way. And then another factor was I didn’t want I wanted to get out before we have kids. So we don’t have any kids right now because I see some of my friends who are staying in and I feel that they have, you know, pressure to provide financially for their families.
00;14;44;05 – 00;14;47;01
Nick Hurff
And I feel like that’s a large influence on why they’re continuing to serve.
00;14;47;10 – 00;14;50;00
Jon Mayo
I think I can definitely understand that pressure.
00;14;50;00 – 00;15;09;22
Lindsey Mayo
We we had all of our children and so, yeah, and he was in the AC three shop. So the you know, you talking about your friend? I for sure. I’m sitting over here going, yeah, we saw him Friday, Saturday and if he was home Saturday and yeah, so yeah, totally relate to that. But that was a big reason why we chose to leave as well.
00;15;10;14 – 00;15;17;08
Nick Hurff
Yeah. So that takes a lot of courage to, to do that, especially when you know, you have a livelihood to maintain and a family to provide for.
00;15;17;25 – 00;15;35;11
Lindsey Mayo
Yeah. And that was, that was the hard part of the jump. Like, okay, this is a great career, great health care, all these different things. And then like the pain it is, there’s something in the civilian sector that’s just as good or better. So it was it was scary trying to be like, you know, well, go against the grain in a sense.
00;15;35;17 – 00;15;37;19
Lindsey Mayo
But it’s been good so far.
00;15;38;04 – 00;16;00;21
Jon Mayo
Yeah. What what’s nice about it is it was for when we’re looking at transitioning, I felt like there’s like this black veil where I knew there’s opportunity out here in the real world, you know, in the world. But I couldn’t see beyond what life would look like serving right. And when we were in, it was so little. It was it was later in the war than when you were.
00;16;00;21 – 00;16;22;00
Jon Mayo
So it the opportunities were drying up really quickly. Yeah. I had a I had a question on that, actually, because I want to hear how you explain it, if you don’t mind. You made a statement that, you know, you had the combat deployment and you got to get into stuff which is good. And then you start talking about how, you know, the combat opportunities to go and do what we’re trained to do.
00;16;22;12 – 00;16;49;18
Jon Mayo
Diminished in that started to change the value proposition. Also looking at the purgatory of being a major club, they’re all in their positions. Yeah, yeah. It’s the the price, you know, that pays their souls. But what for? For those who haven’t served or, you know, those who may not quite understand the statement, what makes you say that? When you got into stuff, it was good, you know.
00;16;49;21 – 00;17;03;27
Jon Mayo
And what made you seek out the combat deployments and lose some level of interest or weight of value and continuing to serve when the opportunities to go in serve in that capacity began driving up. Yeah, that’s.
00;17;03;27 – 00;17;27;23
Nick Hurff
Great. I think so. One of my top values, probably my top was always in the top three is adventure. So for me, that’s kind of I’ve kind of redefined it as I go. But that’s where physically and mentally and really mentally and physically kind of go hand in hand, but definitely physically pushing myself. And there’s a lot of purpose to in that that I find.
00;17;28;05 – 00;17;44;19
Nick Hurff
So when it comes to serving in kind of that type of stuff, there’s a huge amount of purpose you feel and there’s a huge amount of intensity that comes with it. And I think it’s a lot of, you know, there’s a lot of like hormones that go into it that that playing to effect a lot of, you know, psychology stuff that goes into it.
00;17;44;19 – 00;18;15;20
Nick Hurff
But there’s definitely that dopamine hit that you get whether it’s you know I’m rock climbing here, I’m backcountry snowboarding there, you know, deployed. And we’re in a combat zone. We’re getting ready for a mission. There’s a lot of that intensity that is there that I, I kind of crave. And that’s something that is very big to me. So with serving, that was kind of really the big thing to me was that’s what we do especially, you know, I was I was in the infantry in for I guess the listeners.
00;18;15;20 – 00;18;42;07
Nick Hurff
The infantry is kind of the the trigger puller side. So you’re the guys on the ground that are you know, you’re fighting on the ground with your rifles and and whatnot. So when we’re not looking forward or training for deployments and those kind of things, the purpose is less clear. And I guess the purpose is there in theory, but it’s not as prevalent when you’re not preparing for things.
00;18;42;18 – 00;19;05;09
Nick Hurff
So for me looking at, okay, I’m going to be a major and then lieutenant colonel and and pretty much as I’m watching them, they’re just in meetings all day nonstop. And even when we deploy to the field or go to the field, they’re they’re they’re just in talks. You know, they’ll battlefield circulate a bit, but they’re not really, you know, getting after the part that I would find to be the intensity that I’m looking for.
00;19;05;09 – 00;19;28;07
Nick Hurff
So for me, it’s you know, okay, that’s still a value, but can I get that elsewhere? Which, you know, I have been even while I was in just a lot with rock climbing and snowboarding and different things like that, you can you can do to fill that kind of need, especially when as I’m aging and moving up the career wise, I know that’s not really an opportunity that’s in the service as well.
00;19;29;29 – 00;19;54;06
Jon Mayo
Yeah, fair enough. Right? It’s essentially like training to be a firefighter in a world where fire stop happening, Right? But I’m here to do a job and the opportunity to do that job is disappearing. Now, it’s, you know, probably on the large scale, not a bad thing that the those things are in a way, but it’s still why would I you know, if you’re race or it’s the same thing, why am I going to keep training for race if there’s not going to be a race to run it?
00;19;54;16 – 00;19;54;25
Jon Mayo
You know.
00;19;54;26 – 00;19;55;28
Nick Hurff
Exactly.
00;19;55;28 – 00;20;16;07
Jon Mayo
If it’s if it’s just a lap around the block for no other reason. So cool that that absolutely makes sense. And you’re talking about one of your top three values is adventure, Right? Which is also driving your desire to grow in that that provides you a sense of pride and purpose. Yeah. And now you’re in a completely different hair.
00;20;16;13 – 00;20;37;19
Jon Mayo
I’m sorry. Different life. You have your hair grown out. You’re like living. You’re you’re living the good life. And you’ve mentioned some outdoor sports and stuff. Are you able to create in you the adventure you want in your work as well, or are you finding that you have to create a different type of equation to fulfill the values that you’re seeking after.
00;20;38;18 – 00;21;03;23
Nick Hurff
Yeah, that’s great. So I actually love my job, so my job is very rewarding. So I really enjoy what I do with the sports performance side. And a big thing that I value is making an impact on others. So being able to take in athletes and see them getting bigger, faster, stronger and buying into what you’re doing. And I have a lot of autonomy, which is another one of my values with my job.
00;21;03;23 – 00;21;21;03
Nick Hurff
So, you know, I’m the only sports performance coach at the university on that. So I’m able to create the systems and structures which the Army background helps with greatly. As you know, as an officer doing that. But then being able to see how that works is great. So I’m getting a lot of value from work and and I enjoy it.
00;21;21;03 – 00;21;31;25
Nick Hurff
But as far as the adventure side, I do need to kind of carve out time for that the way I’ve been doing it. So my wife and I have to plan out when I do things, which is good. So before it.
00;21;31;25 – 00;21;32;07
Jon Mayo
Was.
00;21;32;23 – 00;21;55;12
Nick Hurff
Yeah, So there’s friction here for a bit because I would get calls from friends or hit up by people to go do things and be like, Hey, can I do this and and whatnot? And after a while it’s just I’ve got to say no sometimes, I guess. So that’s kind of where I have to rack and stack what I want to do and we have to talk about it and plan it out and kind of, you know, both financially and time wise.
00;21;55;12 – 00;22;23;09
Nick Hurff
So both of us have quality time is like our big love language. So that’s a part of it being able to plan things out. But yeah, some stuff I’ve done recently. So I guess in February I did 100 mile adventure race in the mountains. We’re in Virginia, West Virginia area. So it was like, I think the race coordinator, I believe he said it was around 20 4k over across the time of the race.
00;22;23;09 – 00;22;42;01
Nick Hurff
So we finished in 23 hours, 45 seconds and took second in the team category, which is fun. So all of us did the whole thing, but it was it was good to have a slugfest again, which is needed. And that was something that when I separated it had been a little bit no, it wasn’t. February May.
00;22;42;01 – 00;22;42;17
Jon Mayo
May.
00;22;44;14 – 00;22;46;24
Nick Hurff
Is April or May. Yeah, April or May. It wasn’t winter.
00;22;46;24 – 00;22;54;04
Jon Mayo
Is there that you just finished it within a few weeks when we first talked and I think that was around March ish.
00;22;55;15 – 00;22;58;25
Nick Hurff
Okay. Okay. Yes, maybe it was yes, I would have been in March then. Probably.
00;23;00;07 – 00;23;01;02
Jon Mayo
All right. Because, you know.
00;23;01;22 – 00;23;03;08
Lindsey Mayo
Was it cold or in the warmer?
00;23;03;09 – 00;23;06;22
Jon Mayo
Yeah. So. So you’re out there in a cold at night and run.
00;23;07;00 – 00;23;09;02
Lindsey Mayo
Cold at night. So it’s probably springtime then.
00;23;09;10 – 00;23;15;17
Jon Mayo
Yeah. Yeah. Well, since I completely just derailed us by opening our mouth.
00;23;15;17 – 00;23;38;01
Nick Hurff
I forget when but sometime in the late winter to mid spring timeframe. Yeah. So that’s one thing I’ve done. I did another race with some buddies for a weekend in the summer, which was good. And then I started working in the Falls pack, so I haven’t really gotten out anything. Coming up a couple things. Looking to do a backcountry snowboarding trip with a friend in January.
00;23;39;03 – 00;23;53;19
Nick Hurff
We think we’re going to do the Sierras, but we’ll look at the snow pack a little bit more, which is fun because, you know, the fun part about that is there’s a lot of planning that goes into it. So you have to plan, you know, what’s the snow pack look like? What are the hazards where the avalanche is, What’s the go?
00;23;53;19 – 00;24;16;28
Nick Hurff
No go criteria and kind of really plan it out. And then when you’re there, it’s really it’s an all day event. So, you know, you may get two or three runs in, but you’re choosing kind of your adventure and it’s a lot of endurance getting up and and a lot of fun. And then in this February, I have a 300 mile race across Florida that myself and two guys will be doing, which will be fun as well.
00;24;16;28 – 00;24;19;17
Nick Hurff
So it’s a Red Bull event, which is cool.
00;24;20;07 – 00;24;24;17
Lindsey Mayo
And so a team race like do each of you do 100 miles or is that like what’s.
00;24;24;27 – 00;24;31;25
Jon Mayo
In you handstand walk them, right? Like this is 100, 300 miles right now over here, you know.
00;24;32;25 – 00;24;54;26
Nick Hurff
Yeah. All of us do. All 300 miles. So you do it together, you can’t be so far apart, etc.. You plan drop boxes along the way and there’ll be sections. You clear at a time. So think of it like land, right? You hit a bunch of point checkpoints in an area and then you check out and then you move so many miles, you know, go to another area, go around, hit more checkpoints, keep going.
00;24;55;09 – 00;25;04;25
Nick Hurff
So it’s mostly on mountain bike is the main mode of transportation, but they’ll be tracking. I think there’s maybe some canoeing, too, because we navigated for a bit things like that. So it’s pretty fun.
00;25;05;15 – 00;25;06;14
Jon Mayo
Cool. Yeah.
00;25;06;21 – 00;25;28;23
Nick Hurff
And then so to me, in February, I’ll be doing another trip in March for snowboarding in June ish, June or July, I’m going to try to do a Rainier civil ski mountaineer in year. And then in October I’m going to try to go back to El Capitan in Yosemite with a friend, Hayden, and we’re going to try to send that.
00;25;28;23 – 00;25;48;00
Nick Hurff
So he sent it before. I’ve been up there before, but I didn’t make it just wasn’t prepared at the time. There’s a cool opportunity. I have last minute and we knew it was low probability trying because of my lack of training for it. But it was a great learning experience last time. And you know, this time will be I’ll be more prepared.
00;25;48;00 – 00;25;48;08
Nick Hurff
So.
00;25;49;09 – 00;26;25;13
Jon Mayo
So you inject adventure through all these outdoor activities. Now, something that is really screaming to me is the events are fun, but you seem to be finding a lot of joy in the anticipation and the planning of them. Yeah, and they’re looking forward to doing them and then keeping them sprinkled out. Has that has the planning phase of it taken greater weight value for you since like in the last year or so, or has it always been that way for yourself, Like always looking forward to planning and then execution?
00;26;26;15 – 00;26;27;06
Jon Mayo
I think that.
00;26;27;24 – 00;26;46;13
Nick Hurff
So I think there wasn’t as much planning when I was in the Army because everybody had four days and we knew when they were. So it’d be kind of last minute like, Hey, what are we doing for the four day and pick something and do it? I think now I have to plan out markers, you know, I have to plan out my paid time off versus, you know, when when are student athletes at the school versus not.
00;26;46;13 – 00;27;01;07
Nick Hurff
So if they’re not, it’s a lot easier to take. It took a long weekend. So I think there’s the planning is kind of a necessity based on the lifestyle change. But I do enjoy it and I kind of get opportunities and I have to kind of pick and choose which ones I’m going to do and which ones are not.
00;27;01;07 – 00;27;31;10
Jon Mayo
So so on that on that piece, you mentioned that there’s a little bit of friction in the marriage on rack and stacking and figuring that out. If you had to talk to your self exiting the service, looking at, you know, navigating those things moving forward, what would you have advised yourself on? Hey, may spare yourself some heartache and build these systems with your bride so that you guys are able to better care for one another and have the appropriate balances and stuff.
00;27;31;10 – 00;27;55;18
Jon Mayo
You need to not let go of the adventure, right? Because I know a lot of people who, because of arguments with their partners, will end up ultimately losing the things that bring them so much joy. They’ll give them up. Yeah, in an attempt to salvage or make the marriage better, but it just makes them miserable and it creates this like cycle of, you know, despair and contempt for one another.
00;27;56;05 – 00;28;02;15
Jon Mayo
What kept you guys from doing that? And maybe I’m assuming that that’s not where you are, and if that is.
00;28;02;15 – 00;28;26;01
Nick Hurff
No, you’re good. I think one of the great things my wife and I have is we communicate well. So, you know, even if one of us gets a little emotional, we quickly move past it and we kind of come to resolve just through kind of communicating logically, which is good. You know, we don’t have we don’t have these we don’t often have these big blowup scream, you know, kind of things.
00;28;26;01 – 00;28;42;27
Nick Hurff
We’re very, you know, I think compared to, you know, other couples I’ve seen where we’re very able to come to two resolutions on stuff. So I think that’s kind of the big thing. And then going back, I think it’s just kind of as you’re married, you just kind of learn more and more what works, what doesn’t work over time.
00;28;42;27 – 00;28;54;27
Nick Hurff
So I think, you know, I guess, yeah, trying to find a system earlier if there is a way to do it, would have been great. But, you know, it’s always a continual process moving forward. So, you know, it’s working now, which is nice.
00;28;55;24 – 00;29;10;29
Jon Mayo
It sounds like you’re just pushing into the conversations. You guys both are like, okay, here’s the issue. It’s not going to be this big emotional blow up for the most part, but we’re going to communicate through until we’ve solved it enough for today and then onward enough. We’re Yeah.
00;29;11;25 – 00;29;15;16
Nick Hurff
Exactly. And and a big thing. A big thing that we had to work through was.
00;29;16;21 – 00;29;17;08
Jon Mayo
Her.
00;29;17;24 – 00;29;36;07
Nick Hurff
What fills her cup for quality time versus what was mine is different, right? So for me, it’s kind of doing things for her, it’s just having kind of one on one alone time, right? So it’s different. So that was kind of one thing we had to figure out kind of in the marriage. It was kind of how do we take and kind of what does fills that?
00;29;36;07 – 00;30;05;28
Nick Hurff
Because for me it’s like, well, we just did all this stuff like and for her, she’s just not feeling she wasn’t feeling kind of fulfilled in the relationship through those thing. Just more on the micro side, right like in the we she wasn’t like feeling where she would need just more alone time. Right So it’s definitely balancing also now that we more clearly understand each other of what makes us both feel fulfilled, kind of being able to allocate time towards those, which is a big so whereas, you know, I think we’re first married, we kind of had an idea, but it wasn’t as well refined.
00;30;05;28 – 00;30;21;25
Nick Hurff
So when we’re making decisions and allocating time and doing stuff, we weren’t, you know, allocating it where it needed to be for both of us. So I think that’s a big thing is just a give and take in the relationship to make sure we’re both kind of satisfied in it.
00;30;21;25 – 00;30;42;23
Jon Mayo
That’s really good. I’m realizing, because I pick up, you know, quality time right away. I know that you’re talking about like the love languages, right? So in case someone doesn’t know, there are these things called love languages. There’s five of them. There’s a free test. You can take, you know, kind of help you evaluate how you receive love and how you can give love, right?
00;30;43;06 – 00;31;10;00
Jon Mayo
How you can, you know, love and connect with with your significant others and people in your life. And it is a complex thing because both of your number one is quality time, but that’s fulfilled differently. So, yes, it takes a significant amount of intentionality to seek out how you receive and give affection, how your partner does, and then to continue seeking out, Oh yeah, we thought we were good because it’s the same.
00;31;10;00 – 00;31;28;04
Jon Mayo
But what the same is, is different for both of us. So we now have to understand that too. And that’s all just part of the adventure baked into the cake with everything else that’s going on day in and day out anyways. So it’s not like it’s its own separate thing where that’s where all the attention’s going, you know?
00;31;28;14 – 00;31;30;07
Jon Mayo
Yeah, it’s, yeah, the.
00;31;30;10 – 00;31;37;06
Nick Hurff
The book is a great read short reader. I recommend it everybody, most of our platoon read it on deployment. At least the guys with me.
00;31;37;20 – 00;31;39;19
Jon Mayo
Was going Yeah, what was it call it?
00;31;39;20 – 00;31;40;21
Lindsey Mayo
It’s five Love Languages.
00;31;40;29 – 00;31;43;13
Jon Mayo
Five Languages by Gary Chapman.
00;31;43;14 – 00;31;44;12
Lindsey Mayo
Is that right? Yes.
00;31;45;07 – 00;32;20;23
Jon Mayo
A pretty straightforward title, giving the content right? Yeah. Not too much creativity. Cool. Yeah, I remember they’d have stacks giving them out. Definitely worth a read, of course. So thank you for letting us go down that, you know, jump into your personal life and marriage in that aspect. Yeah, it it’s interesting because I do think generally we as a society can do a better job of asking those types of questions and tending to our homes while we’re also trying to figure out life and a way forward.
00;32;21;01 – 00;32;41;14
Jon Mayo
Right? It’s just a collective solution, not just a one sided one. So I do appreciate that. Okay, so here we are. You have a year’s worth of adventures ahead. You’re starting to find a niche on some of the things you like to do. Lots of mountain bike, long distance suck fests. What is it about the suck fest specifically?
00;32;41;14 – 00;32;58;24
Jon Mayo
Because you can have an adventure that’s not terribly uncomfortable, Correct? Why are you pursuing discomfort as part of these adventures? Because that was something in every one of them. You’re like, Oh yeah, that’s going to be brutal. And as you’re talking about them. So yeah, I.
00;32;58;24 – 00;33;20;12
Nick Hurff
Think it’s just I think that you learn more about yourself and you kind of grow when you’re in those places. And I feel more satisfaction like I accomplish something when I do it as well. So it just kind of, you know, I love snowboarding. So, you know, going to resorts and stuff is great because you kind of just ride the lift up.
00;33;20;12 – 00;33;41;22
Nick Hurff
You’re with your friends and you have a blast. But there’s a difference between that and when you work for it. And I think that’s kind of a big part. And I think just kind of I don’t know what it is, but, you know, the dopamine hit you get is a lot greater when you’re, you know, fatigued and tired and just pushing through.
00;33;41;22 – 00;33;52;09
Nick Hurff
And then there’s the mental side of challenging yourself, you know, like the inner dialog you have when you’re going through tough times and it makes you feel, I think you grow stronger when you go through those.
00;33;53;13 – 00;34;15;23
Jon Mayo
Yeah, I fully agree. So obviously the show is called The Grit Theory in In Grit, defined as just courage, bravery and resolve, determination despite difficulty and, you know, pursuing well, one life’s going to knock you out. So I’m of the mind like I want to make certain circumstances so much harder on myself than anything life can throw at me.
00;34;16;24 – 00;34;37;19
Jon Mayo
Yeah, or at least that I can imagine, right? Because it builds a certain level of confidence, right. Going here. It’s like, okay, if I do this at four in the morning, it’s unlikely anything will happen today. That’s worse than what I just did to myself, right? Yeah. There’s there’s some joy in that, and it’s definitely something I think that’s fun in pushing through.
00;34;37;20 – 00;34;57;12
Jon Mayo
You remind me a lot of one of my buddies named Billy, who’s essentially doing the similar adventures all the time, looking for the suck fest all the time. It’s one of the reasons we’re actually great friends, especially the success piece, and it just becomes a part of life that if you remove it, things just slow down and stagnate.
00;34;57;14 – 00;35;01;07
Jon Mayo
It’s like a necessary catalyst. Yeah, you know?
00;35;01;14 – 00;35;19;15
Nick Hurff
Exactly. Yeah, it’s kind of Yeah. Like I get I get eager. If I haven’t done something for a while, I get kind of fidgety. And that’s kind of where, you know, figuring out what I’m going to do, even if it’s local, even if it’s just going for a bike ride or whatever, is kind of a big thing.
00;35;20;09 – 00;35;38;23
Jon Mayo
Yeah, absolutely. So looking at the future, you have the adventure set up. You’ve had a history of a path that’s upward and trajectory. You’re in a job that’s fulfilling and you love it. What what’s the future look like for you? Is there do you see kids and figuring out the family piece being the next big adventure?
00;35;39;20 – 00;35;40;18
Nick Hurff
Well, I think so.
00;35;40;22 – 00;35;41;04
Jon Mayo
Or what?
00;35;41;27 – 00;36;00;26
Nick Hurff
Yeah, I think so. I think so. Right now where I’m kind of pushing is I’m trying to I’m trying to focus more on being present, kind of like in the present moment, because that’s something that in the past, especially in the military so fast that I think that’s something we often miss. So that’s something I’m trying to work on kind of daily.
00;36;02;10 – 00;36;13;23
Nick Hurff
It’s kind of that aspect. And then another part that I’m kind of working through is the dichotomy between like attainment and attunement. So I don’t know if you’re familiar with that kind of framework.
00;36;14;07 – 00;36;15;28
Jon Mayo
We pull on it. Yeah.
00;36;16;03 – 00;36;39;08
Nick Hurff
So attainment is kind of achieving things and attunement is kind of just living fulfilled kind of in the moment, right, or in life. And sometimes they come at a cost with one another. So it’s kind of trying to harmonize the two. So typically, you know, when we’re younger, we’re way more looking at achieving things, doing things, accomplishing stuff, whether it’s career wise, personalized, etc..
00;36;39;20 – 00;36;51;15
Nick Hurff
Whereas, you know, later in life you kind of switch more of the attunement side where that kind of tempers down, but it’s kind of always present. So I like to kind of keep that framework in mind because it kind of helps me to be like.
00;36;51;15 – 00;36;52;20
Jon Mayo
Okay.
00;36;52;20 – 00;37;09;08
Nick Hurff
Am I planning things to do this? And we’re planning to do that. Do I want to do this thing? Yeah, but at the same time it’s kind of trying to slow down and just kind of enjoy the moment that we’re in and. That’s sometimes hard for me because I’m naturally more of a planner. So that’s kind of another part is something that I’m kind of working on too.
00;37;09;22 – 00;37;11;14
Nick Hurff
So I kind of think like you. Yeah.
00;37;11;23 – 00;37;21;24
Jon Mayo
About. Yeah, I was just going to ask, how is the pursuing being present working for you? Like what’s that look like in the day to day as an exercise or as a mentality shift?
00;37;21;24 – 00;37;45;24
Nick Hurff
Yeah, I think it’s just trying to slow down. So I think, you know, breath work helps for sure and just kind of trying to slow it down. I think trying to find ways to stimulate the like parasympathetic nervous system helps as well. So whether that’s kind of music for me, I do yoga every morning and it didn’t have to be long.
00;37;45;24 – 00;38;05;12
Nick Hurff
So it’s just some of the athletes I train individually, I encourage this and some of the ones I train at the university as well, depending on what they need. But just every morning I wake up, go to the bathroom, drink some water, and then I turn the coffee coffee maker on. And while the coffee is getting ready, I just do yoga for a couple of minutes.
00;38;05;12 – 00;38;22;10
Nick Hurff
Like, you know, I always tell myself, you know, I’m only going to do if I don’t want to do it that day. I just always say, okay, do one minute and that’s it. And typically one minute leads to two, leads to three, leads to more. But usually I’m doing, you know, anywhere from 10 to 20 minutes. And that’s something that kind of grounds yourself.
00;38;22;24 – 00;38;44;02
Nick Hurff
Another thing is just grounding exercises as well. So when I learn so when I went up on El Capitan before I had my buddy hit me up about four weeks before and was like, Hey, my partner bailed, do you want to go up? And I was like, Well, we both know I have an aid climbed, which is a technique you need for it and different things.
00;38;44;02 – 00;39;00;18
Nick Hurff
So, you know, like let’s just train real hard for a couple of weeks and we’ll give it a shot. And we both know it’s low success, but the biggest hindrance for that was for sending. It was really my psychology. So like the things I couldn’t do up there at like 1500 feet, I could do at 100 feet, right?
00;39;00;18 – 00;39;25;05
Nick Hurff
So it’s more the mental side. So coming there, coming back, I worked with a sports performance psychologist that they had on base actually for a bit. So she had some different exercises to help with it, kind of stimulating the grounding yourself coming back present and trying to, you know, tamper down that sympathetic nervous system, which is the fight or flight side, which we’re kind of always in in that military thing with just how busy we are.
00;39;26;00 – 00;39;33;10
Nick Hurff
But for grounding, one thing I do is there’s five senses. So you try to pick two things, persons that you can.
00;39;34;18 – 00;39;35;02
Jon Mayo
Really.
00;39;35;02 – 00;40;03;04
Nick Hurff
Notice. So it smells for me because I get allergies sometimes, but try to smell something. Look at two things you can see visually and the more detail the better. So if it’s like even just tiny shadows off of something or the texture on something, two things you can feel. Taste is another hard one for two. But if you can get one thing that you can notice tasting and then hearing as well, and you just kind of run through that and only takes about 10 seconds and then it kind of just whatever is going on in your mind just kind of quiets down and you kind of come back to center.
00;40;03;19 – 00;40;25;04
Nick Hurff
So those help Breathwork helps as well. There’s a bunch of breathing things you can do. There’s kind of a variety of menu, but that’s kind of in the daily life when I find myself, whether it’s anxiousness, which is really just concern about the future, which I have a tendency to be anxious from time to time, that’s something that I can employ to kind of quiet myself down.
00;40;25;04 – 00;40;42;23
Nick Hurff
And really that’s more my thoughts are racing like, okay, heading to work, I got to do this or that. And thinking about this meeting I have or whatever, and then I can kind of just employ something and just kind of quiet down and try to recenter. And, you know, I wouldn’t say I’m good at it, but the more you do it, the better you get.
00;40;43;09 – 00;41;02;04
Nick Hurff
So just kind of being able to notice and be aware of it’s the big thing. And then just trying to do stuff helps. So that’s kind of where I’m working on and I’ve definitely gotten better. I’ve gotten better over the last like probably I’ve been doing it for about a year and a half now. I’ve been getting better, so.
00;41;02;27 – 00;41;13;01
Jon Mayo
I’ll be looking forward to hearing how the breathing techniques and grinding yourself works ten or 1500 feet up in the air again, that yeah, it’s the same thing that Yeah, yeah, it’s.
00;41;13;01 – 00;41;32;19
Nick Hurff
The same thing though taking intentional deep breathing Yeah controlled actually helps you to focus in center. So even when I’m training before I get on to a boulder problem or whatever I’m doing, even in a gym, I’ll run through, you know, a quick close my eyes, run through a quick grounding and then I’ll do a quick visualization what I’m about to do, and then I’ll do it.
00;41;33;04 – 00;41;33;27
Nick Hurff
And that kind of helps.
00;41;34;09 – 00;41;48;09
Jon Mayo
You really can’t afford to be overly anxious about slipping five feet up further up when you have five feet to climb in front of you. So being able to focus and slow things down is probably going to be a helpful adjustment this next time up. I’ll keep right.
00;41;49;02 – 00;42;03;07
Nick Hurff
Yeah that and in stress inoculation too you know like that was my first time up that high so being up that high already, I can visualize on it and be fine and then you can just the higher I can get training, the more you, you know, you become comfortable with it.
00;42;03;27 – 00;42;10;16
Jon Mayo
You know, I want to do some more stress inoculation in my life and figure out how maybe I’ll start climbing some of the trees in the back of the property and.
00;42;11;15 – 00;42;12;29
Nick Hurff
I just give the kid pots and pans.
00;42;13;14 – 00;42;17;13
Jon Mayo
Yet they were they attacked me last night and they.
00;42;17;14 – 00;42;18;17
Lindsey Mayo
Actually was Hillary went.
00;42;18;17 – 00;42;38;17
Jon Mayo
Outside to get something from the garage and I hear screaming and they all running at me. It’s it’s twilight with sticks like long sticks and I throw myself in the garage, slammed the door and locking. They start lifting the garage door. So I slam that down off of you. Just yeah, yeah. No, like there’s no sliding door. Yeah.
00;42;39;01 – 00;42;58;20
Jon Mayo
So, like, I closed the normal door and then they start opening the sliding door, so I slam them down and they’re like hitting the garage and they’re going to kill you. And I’m in there like, goodness gracious. Like, they’re insane. So the way I screwed out the back of the garage, they they hear me running and scream. They’re getting away.
00;42;58;20 – 00;43;05;17
Jon Mayo
So then I barely get in the house and I do it for like an hour. I could not get them to stop trying to beat me to death with sticks.
00;43;05;17 – 00;43;15;10
Lindsey Mayo
It was so funny. They kept coming in there different like doors that we have to be able to get into the house. And I was dying laughing. It was so funny.
00;43;15;10 – 00;43;16;22
Jon Mayo
Like big sticks, like mini battle.
00;43;16;23 – 00;43;17;17
Lindsey Mayo
Yeah, like.
00;43;17;17 – 00;43;20;09
Jon Mayo
Like it’s not, it’s not funny and cute. It’s like, dear God, it’s.
00;43;20;10 – 00;43;30;07
Lindsey Mayo
Like these are like probably 4 to 5 foot sticks that they’re using. And like, one of them has to of one of them referred to his as a Loki stick like, so this is.
00;43;30;07 – 00;43;32;18
Nick Hurff
Kind of like light sabers on almost when you were a kid.
00;43;33;02 – 00;43;35;22
Jon Mayo
Yeah, correct. Basically they hurt way more because they’re not.
00;43;36;09 – 00;43;38;18
Lindsey Mayo
Actually hit you with you for sure. Yeah.
00;43;38;19 – 00;43;48;03
Jon Mayo
They go to the garage door. So it’s like, Yeah. And they’re always that out of control. Like, I don’t know if they got into the loco weed or some like cocaine that we don’t have on the, they got into something.
00;43;48;03 – 00;43;48;24
Lindsey Mayo
I have no idea.
00;43;49;04 – 00;44;06;15
Jon Mayo
And it was wild. But you said pots and pans. I was like, oh man, that sticks last night. That definitely it was funny because it’s like, I can’t fight them because I’ll, you know, hurt them, but I can’t defend myself either. So like, there’s this really small, small hormonal response as they’re like, screeching and running around you and I’m running away.
00;44;06;15 – 00;44;08;05
Nick Hurff
Yeah. Your heart starts racing a little more.
00;44;08;09 – 00;44;18;17
Jon Mayo
Yeah. So, goodness gracious. And they think I’m playing and they don’t think that when I’m serious at this point that I’m being serious. So like I said, All right, that’s enough. They’d start laughing harder.
00;44;18;21 – 00;44;19;00
Lindsey Mayo
Yeah.
00;44;19;00 – 00;44;28;10
Jon Mayo
So, like, it took me a while to find, like, I had to grab a hold of them so that they’d realize, okay, now we’re done, guys. Like, for 30 minutes, you’ve been tormenting me. That’s enough. But it was fun.
00;44;28;23 – 00;44;29;19
Lindsey Mayo
It was hilarious.
00;44;29;19 – 00;44;33;16
Jon Mayo
It was wild. Goodness gracious.
00;44;34;05 – 00;44;36;23
Lindsey Mayo
That was your stress. That was your stress for last night.
00;44;37;00 – 00;44;39;17
Jon Mayo
That was the fun stress. Not like I was genuinely surprised.
00;44;39;18 – 00;44;45;08
Lindsey Mayo
I like to climb the trees in the back and none them will let me. The boys won’t let me.
00;44;45;08 – 00;44;51;08
Jon Mayo
You just go back and all of a sudden you’ll see her red hair like up a frickin 30 foot. Like she’s just climbing the pine.
00;44;51;08 – 00;44;57;24
Lindsey Mayo
Tree, climbing trees. It’s the boys yell at me. They’re like, You can’t die. Dad’s allowed to die. You’re not allowed to climb the tree.
00;44;58;15 – 00;45;14;07
Jon Mayo
Yeah, You know, that’s how you know you’re raised in a military family. When the kids are like, Yeah, Dad can die, but you can’t, like, Oh, man. So while I’m trying to remember, I think when we talked last, I was doing like this five K day.
00;45;14;07 – 00;45;14;18
Lindsey Mayo
Thing.
00;45;15;11 – 00;45;19;16
Jon Mayo
And yeah, you’re, I did. That’s not very smart. I know. Well.
00;45;20;08 – 00;45;22;21
Lindsey Mayo
But you just you had to stop.
00;45;22;24 – 00;45;28;25
Jon Mayo
I did, yeah. I had a significant overuse injury that we actually talked about. Your idea. That doesn’t sound good was.
00;45;28;25 – 00;45;29;23
Nick Hurff
It begins your knees.
00;45;30;07 – 00;45;34;14
Jon Mayo
It was Achilles tendon. Oh, yeah. Yeah. In the feet.
00;45;34;28 – 00;45;41;08
Lindsey Mayo
Well, so I picked up for the last, what was it, 48 days or something like that. So I ran the last 48 days for him.
00;45;41;08 – 00;45;44;28
Jon Mayo
I changed the challenge because I couldn’t keep running it like.
00;45;44;29 – 00;45;46;05
Nick Hurff
To watching your life or on the.
00;45;46;07 – 00;46;06;10
Jon Mayo
Sofa? Well, it was a multifaceted contract with myself, but I had to let go of the run. I switched to the assault bike and she picked up nine so that the run would be finished, which was awesome of her because I didn’t ask her to. Like, I was like, heartbroken to have to change it. But the last one I did on day 55 was like, If I keep doing this, my Achilles are going.
00;46;06;10 – 00;46;09;01
Lindsey Mayo
To be it was going to it was going to lead to surgery. It was bad.
00;46;09;09 – 00;46;22;14
Jon Mayo
I knew that. I knew I was pushing the limit beyond beyond stubbornness into stupidity. And but super awesome because she picked up the wrench, did it. But I’m a glutton for punishment. I’m on day 96 right now.
00;46;22;28 – 00;46;24;19
Lindsey Mayo
Of another 5ka day run.
00;46;25;09 – 00;46;26;28
Nick Hurff
I’m like, Nice. You feel stronger now?
00;46;28;07 – 00;46;49;09
Jon Mayo
Yes, I feel stronger in that. I know I can sustain what I’m doing. I could do this probably forever, but it’s terrible the it’s been and one of those, like mental games. Yeah, like this. This is not getting me in the physical shape I want to be. This is not the range of motion in health I want, but I’ve learned so stinkin much staying the course.
00;46;49;09 – 00;47;13;00
Jon Mayo
Like I stopped drinking because of this challenge. Because I realized I can’t afford to drink and keep doing this because the inflammation and stuff is too much with like these frayed tendons and stuff that’s going on. So it’s like 15 more days and it’s done and I’m very excited to all of my training is going to focus at that point physically on well-being and capacity right?
00;47;13;00 – 00;47;36;28
Jon Mayo
Not on just slugging it out, but it was wild because sure enough, you’re right. One of the things that I think that hit me was psych. You’re talking about the psychology piece on the on the climb is what got you, because you’re able to do things that 100 feet up that you weren’t at 1500 feet up. And for myself, my psychology was all messed up going through the first one where like, essentially I was just trying to grunt it out.
00;47;36;28 – 00;48;04;12
Jon Mayo
And then I didn’t know how to respond to the different pain stimuli in the different injuries. Whereas this time I was like, okay, what can I do? See? Like, I’m stretching a lot more. I’m doing therapy throughout the day. I’m rolling differently. I start, I’m adjusting diet and sleep and they’re gunning and drinking ultimately, and continuing to remove things that are inflammatory to the point that now I’m in a sustained spot.
00;48;04;28 – 00;48;30;11
Jon Mayo
I’m starting to pick up speed again. And it’s been right at this point. So check the box for the last couple days. Yeah, but it was it was fun pulling on the parallel between the how strong psychology is and even something like climbing El Capitan is pretty sexy, but even something as simple as going for a few mile run a day, which is what a5k is, it’s that there’s such a psychological component of doing that for 110 days.
00;48;30;26 – 00;48;45;15
Nick Hurff
Yeah, because it’s a it’s not like we’re used to just okay, let’s push through this next hour or 2 hours, 24 hours, whatever. And then there’s an end in sight. But when it’s months, months away, it’s it’s a different grind.
00;48;46;02 – 00;49;16;12
Jon Mayo
That that’s been the challenge, man. It’s really been an adjustment of like, okay, I still have 60 days. I still have 40 days. Like, you know, different aspects. Like even right now I’m just bored with it. I’m kind of over it. It’s like I stopped 15 days. Goodness gracious, that’s over two weeks. But the the staying power, especially being so conditioned for rapid cycles, has been such a gift because it’s changing my perspective on like right now I’m actually working on a book.
00;49;16;12 – 00;49;40;17
Jon Mayo
Once you just edited the first draft and gave it back to me, dripping in red ink was awesome and before it would be like, okay, you write and you’d surge for a couple of weeks and it’s not done. You’re kind of demotivated. But now it’s like, No, this is a journey and it changes the perspective and it ties in for me on the eye, the difference between attainment and tainment.
00;49;40;17 – 00;50;10;11
Jon Mayo
Right? There’s you know, the things that we’re pursuing now are more weighted in significance like significance and depth of relationship in the types of things that they affect than in just accomplishing the next shiny thing or the next blitz project and just getting it done in out of the way. It’s more of a how can we journey through life accomplishing things and building things of value opposed to just checking the block, you know, which was definitely a danger I can relate to as well.
00;50;10;29 – 00;50;14;17
Jon Mayo
When you’re just going through life at a million miles an hour. Yeah.
00;50;14;17 – 00;50;29;13
Nick Hurff
And that’s. Yeah, I like that a lot. Exactly. It’s also you kind of have to narrow down the importance of it to yourself. Hmm. Why is it why is it what purpose does it have for you to make it more meaningful?
00;50;29;13 – 00;50;51;11
Jon Mayo
Yeah, you’re absolutely right. And that, you know, it’s the same thing for you when you go out and you do a climate, you do 300 mile, the 300 mile race with your team and stuff, there’s a number of values that are at play. You know, it’s not just going and being on a bike for three miles. You’re you have the the comradeship of the team going through a hard thing together, learning more about yourself, accomplishing this adventure.
00;50;51;26 – 00;51;21;00
Jon Mayo
That’s a feeling all these different marks, you know, And like this current one, it’s not the five. Give a credit about running the five K, but it’s what it’s causing me to think about during that and the type of husband a man I’m becoming and father and all those things. So it’s it’s good. I love it and I love seeing the different ways people especially from like our line of work in the past pursue creating purpose in meaning without, you know, wearing the flag on our shoulder.
00;51;21;15 – 00;51;22;27
Jon Mayo
So it’s been a fun adventure.
00;51;23;17 – 00;51;48;06
Nick Hurff
Yeah, definitely. I love how you’re going back a little bit to just your kind of amplifying the recovery process for this next kind of five K series you’re doing is huge because really that’s the biggest thing that hinders most athletes is the recovery. You know, a lot of times we have the mental capacity to train hard, but we don’t recover hard or well and that’s kind of the biggest thing we see.
00;51;48;06 – 00;52;07;18
Nick Hurff
You know, I see it with that’s one of the biggest things I have to do with some of the teams is just explain to them recovery strategies, whether it’s nutrition, sleep. I mean, really just those two things alone. They don’t do nutrition, sleep, alcohol, especially for a collegiate athlete. They mess up all the time. So being able to narrow those in is huge.
00;52;07;18 – 00;52;26;19
Nick Hurff
And doing it in our own personal life is huge as well. And, you know, the anti-inflammatory diet is great, especially for for endurance athlete. Really any athlete is big as well. So I think everything you’re hitting on is huge. Four pillars in success. And especially as you know, we’re in our thirties, you’re in your power. You know.
00;52;27;24 – 00;52;30;04
Jon Mayo
I’m 29, I’m still a little bit older.
00;52;30;04 – 00;52;34;09
Nick Hurff
But yeah, I mean, yeah, I’m 31 tomorrow. Oh.
00;52;35;01 – 00;52;35;17
Lindsey Mayo
Happy birthday.
00;52;36;12 – 00;52;37;06
Nick Hurff
And Lindsey, how are you?
00;52;37;23 – 00;52;43;05
Lindsey Mayo
I’m. How old am I? 30. 31. 31. Oh, yeah, I’m 31.
00;52;43;10 – 00;52;43;20
Jon Mayo
Yeah.
00;52;44;02 – 00;52;46;16
Lindsey Mayo
I think yeah, I’m turning 32 next year. Sorry your.
00;52;46;16 – 00;52;46;24
Jon Mayo
Age.
00;52;47;04 – 00;52;53;24
Lindsey Mayo
I know I’ve not, I’ve not thought about it for a while so I guess that’s. Yeah, it’s 21. Yep. Yep. 31. Yep. I’m sure.
00;52;54;02 – 00;52;56;11
Jon Mayo
Were good. Sorry for that. Painful. Painful.
00;52;56;29 – 00;53;01;08
Lindsey Mayo
I thought about it in a while. I’m like, Oh, man, I got to actually do math here.
00;53;02;18 – 00;53;05;28
Nick Hurff
It’s okay. My grandma was 29 every year of her life that I know her. So.
00;53;05;28 – 00;53;06;25
Lindsey Mayo
Yeah, yeah, that’s.
00;53;07;04 – 00;53;07;10
Jon Mayo
Yeah.
00;53;08;11 – 00;53;28;11
Nick Hurff
But yeah, as we’re aging, I think being able to do those becomes more and more important because, you know, we don’t recover as quickly anyways. Making it intentional allows us to keep kind of pushing the limits more so. And I think that was one thing that I learned was, you know, I came from the regular army where guys are retiring between 38 to 42 and they look just beat down.
00;53;29;00 – 00;53;50;20
Nick Hurff
And then I went there and there’s guys in their 50 seconds who are great. You know, they’re bodybuilding, they’re early sixties or doing all kinds of stuff in their fifties, still running, gone and that kind of thing. And it just it was it was reassuring to know, like, oh, wow, you know, all these my perception of how far I could extend kind of my active lifestyle just completely transformed in my brain, which is pretty neat.
00;53;51;13 – 00;54;17;12
Jon Mayo
So when I come in, that is inspiring because it’s so often that I’ll talk to someone who’s 35, 40, 45 and they’re like, Oh, that that ship has passed. It’s like, it really hasn’t. You do like the more you’ve gone off the rails, the harder the correction needs to be. But the opportunity extends like you said, you’re seeing guys in their fifties and bodybuilding in their sixties, and it’s it’s just the series of choices.
00;54;17;12 – 00;54;43;05
Jon Mayo
And I actually owe you a thank you because essentially when you and I first spoke earlier this year and set up the opportunity set here, you gave me like a free consultation, unlike some of the Neanderthal crap I was doing to myself. And you’re like, Well, John, you may just want to consider like, these things. I don’t even know if you remember, but you gave me like a list of things to consider, and it’s because of those that I’m going to finish this hundred and ten day one now, so I don’t need it.
00;54;43;05 – 00;54;44;19
Jon Mayo
Yeah, you’re welcome. Yes, pretty.
00;54;44;19 – 00;54;46;26
Nick Hurff
Solid. I don’t quite remember all of it, but that’s great.
00;54;48;00 – 00;55;05;28
Jon Mayo
Don’t worry. I wrote it down when we were talking. That helped me. But. But with that. So right now you’re doing sports performance and exercise science. I know that you’re shirt. You are employed by a university. So that’s it. Are you doing you also mentioned Spike private athlete. So do you have a Moonlight Side practice as well that you do?
00;55;06;22 – 00;55;36;17
Nick Hurff
Kind of. So I started that before. So I’m I’m hired by St Luke’s University Health Network. So it’s a health network and then I’m contracted through the Health Network to Albany University in Pennsylvania as their strength conditioning coach or sports performance coach. So I work every day there for the most part. Occasionally I go to the health network where there’s a hierarchy and there’s some really great leaders in the organization who develop us, which are great.
00;55;36;17 – 00;55;57;21
Nick Hurff
They’ve been in for decades in the field or professionally. And like, you know, the Netflix, etc.. And that that’s awesome because again, I’m learning and developing the athletes. I’m working for one on one. I’d started before this job, and since I’m coming to the university, they’ve never had a performance coach before and I’m building all the systems and everything.
00;55;58;05 – 00;56;20;07
Nick Hurff
I’ve pretty much stopped expanding anything that I was doing on my own and really just kind of sustained those I was working with, which is great going forward. You know, after I get everything set and established and do things properly here, then, you know, I think having that on the back burner would be good going forward. But yeah, I’ve worked with a variety of athletes before.
00;56;20;07 – 00;56;45;26
Nick Hurff
I’ve worked with, you know, different people I know or connections from different people. So I’ve worked with a couple members from Concord Academy, from Jeremiah Sullivan’s company. So some of his clients, he’s kind of recommended me to them. I actually spoke to their company at one of their you know, development kind of speak. I was like a guest speaker, I guess, for one of their developmental series and whatnot.
00;56;46;13 – 00;57;08;25
Nick Hurff
And I’ve worked with some friends, friends of friends, stuff like that, with a variety kind of some rock climbers, mountain guide, guys who are big into the backcountry skiing ski mountaineering side, too. Just regular people, some military folks, a lot of soccer players as well with my background and, you know, just my brother’s coach, One coaches college soccer.
00;57;08;25 – 00;57;14;22
Nick Hurff
So he recommends some guys in semi-pro leagues and things like that. So it’s kind of nice to kind of have a variety.
00;57;15;09 – 00;57;15;20
Lindsey Mayo
Yeah, that’s.
00;57;15;20 – 00;57;42;14
Jon Mayo
Awesome. Yeah, that’s good. Well, next, thanks for meeting with us today and a conversation letting us dissect, you know, over the open mic. You know, I can’t help but think so. You have these pursuits for intentionality and presence, you know, looking for the autonomy between attainment. And you have adventures ahead of you in adventures behind in your cultivating this lifestyle that keeps it going.
00;57;42;14 – 00;58;04;28
Jon Mayo
Right? You’re you’re being in you want to continue the adventures and deepening the relationship with your wife and family and everything that comes with that. If there’s someone who is listening to this, it’s like, okay, cool, well, I’m not going to go climb all cap. I’m not going to go be a sports performance. Guys have no idea how to do this when I’m 40, 50, 60.
00;58;05;08 – 00;58;13;02
Jon Mayo
How would you encourage someone to start injecting adventure consistency and intentionality into their lives if they’re a bit lost in that?
00;58;14;05 – 00;58;36;03
Nick Hurff
Yeah. So I start off with a values exercise just. Find your values and you know the way I do the values exercise. Some people call personal ideals. So depending on the framework, so personal ideals would be what we generally consider values. That’s ideally how what is what are my priorities? What do I care the most about? What do I enjoy?
00;58;36;06 – 00;58;57;12
Nick Hurff
What means the most to me? And then values would be more in practice. Like where? What? Where do I where do I place my time? Energy effort is then my actual values. So there could be a difference. But regardless, just figure out like your ideals or your what your values are you want them to be, and then just start to kind of push into it and do things that you enjoy.
00;58;57;12 – 00;59;26;06
Nick Hurff
And I think if you can kind of look at, okay, these are my ideals or my values and now I want to focus my time into it. You can even write out a weekly schedule if that helps. That’s a method that may help and kind of carve out time for it. And then a lot of times people will find they spend a lot of time doing things that are relatively meaningless to them, whether it’s, you know, social media addictions on your phones or coming home and binge watching the news or TV and things like that, that may not add value.
00;59;26;06 – 00;59;42;14
Nick Hurff
So I think kind of identifying really deep down, what do you care about, what makes you feel good and then orienting your time into it, I think is the way to go. That’s kind of how I started out with it. And then, you know, whatever you are, if it’s adventure, just start with something that you enjoy, something you think you can do.
00;59;43;03 – 00;59;58;12
Nick Hurff
When we start something you think you can do that you’re going to enjoy, start there. And then just every time. Just ramp it up a little bit if you want. So really, like 10% is a good place to go. So really, you know, if you increase the intensity by 10%, you’re probably not going to get injured or hurt.
00;59;58;12 – 01;00;16;17
Nick Hurff
And then after you get a base, then you can kind of launch further, Right? So, you know, you can do once you build up a base enough, then you can kind of go like push it far. So, you know, if your weekly mileage, let’s say, is like weekly, let’s say I was doing part of a 100 mile race, I was doing, you know, 6 to 10 hours a week on the mountain bike.
01;00;16;17 – 01;00;43;00
Nick Hurff
Right? So I can easily go from that large amount of mileage in a week and then put it into one day and go for it, but just start small and just slowly build up and up and build up. And then, you know, you’ll know when to push hard.
