EXPLORING THE TOOLS THAT UNLEASH HUMAN POTENTIAL
Episode 11 from The Grit Theory.
Today we are joined by Rick Clapp. During our conversation we explore leadership, work life balance, and how to live abundantly. Our time together uncovers nugget after nugget of insight and wisdom. Rick is a husband of 27 years, father of 6, and founder of “Beyond Survival”. Highlights from this episode include:
– Theory of Constraints.
– The importance of self regulation.
– Leading on Empty, and how to fix it.
– Journey towards intentionality.
– The 5% Framework
– The Red, Yellow, Green Scale.
– Living abundantly vs. surviving.
– The Power of Full Engagement.
– Why we need to learn to combine our personal and professional pursuits.
Want to learn more? Check Rick’s work out at:
BEYOND SURVIVAL
Did you find value in today’s conversation? SHARE IT!
Also, check out Be Relentless: If the obstacle is the way, then we must be waymakers HERE.
Do you want to learn more? Check out:
The Book: Be Relentless: If the obstacle is the way, then we must be WayMakers.
The Podcast: “Be Relentless Podcast”
The Fuel: Sisu Stamina, Performance Evolved
Linktree: Here.
08;06;40;10 – 08;06;23;13
Aaron
Well, good morning, everybody, and Grit Theory, we are so glad to be here this morning with a brand new guest. You guys better, better buckle up for this guy because he’s got years and years of difficulty that he’s he’s honed into fantastic pieces of wisdom.
08;06;22;19 – 08;06;08;27
Aaron
We’re going to we’re going to press into my good friend Rick Clapp. Thanks for being here today. Thanks for having me. Rick is a guy worth knowing. I’ve I’ve talked to other people who know Rick and they will say he’s he talks in Proverbs.
08;06;08;27 – 08;06;00;13
Aaron
He speaks just a little quips like, huh? It just causes you pause and not to put too much pressure on you, Rick. I think.
08;06;00;13 – 08;05;59;28
Aaron
It was made.
08;05;59;28 – 08;05;59;17
Aaron
Of glass.
08;05;58;19 – 08;05;45;14
Aaron
But you really are. I mean, Rick has been doing leadership in some in some venues or another for the last 20 plus years. He’s been a husband of 27 years, so bravo there. I’m sure you learned a lot through that as well.
08;05;44;28 – 08;05;37;02
Jon
And a husband or a sort of father of six kids, three boys, three girls. All right. You got a lot of people in your life, but.
08;05;37;02 – 08;05;36;08
Aaron
Activity at the.
08;05;36;08 – 08;05;34;29
Aaron
House, you too.
08;05;34;29 – 08;05;31;00
Jon
I think you’re the first gentleman to be on with more kids than either of us.
08;05;30;25 – 08;05;29;21
Aaron
Oh, yeah, right?
08;05;29;21 – 08;05;26;19
Aaron
Yeah. So we’re no longer with that was good.
08;05;26;15 – 08;05;21;10
Aaron
Yeah, I can be that. We’re going to get lost. We got some very good Premiere.
08;05;21;01 – 08;05;11;13
Aaron
You’re just telling me this is kind of cool. You said your you make a habit when your kids are seniors to do kind of a connection point with them, you know? Yeah, what you’re doing.
08;05;11;08 – 08;05;07;25
Rick
Yeah, my wife and I want to do a senior trip for.
08;05;07;25 – 08;05;04;03
Aaron
Which one of our kiddos and this year is heavy.
08;05;04;02 – 08;05;01;18
Rick
And usually we do. Guys knew the guys.
08;05;01;18 – 08;04;58;18
Aaron
So I’ll do with the boys or girls.
08;04;58;09 – 08;04;55;29
Rick
Yeah, but Abby wants to do backpacking.
08;04;55;23 – 08;04;52;03
Aaron
Which Laura doesn’t do, so I’m excited to get her. So we’re.
08;04;52;03 – 08;04;51;15
Rick
Going to do.
08;04;51;05 – 08;04;48;05
Aaron
A road trip ten days up to the northwest and.
08;04;47;13 – 08;04;46;08
Rick
Live in a van down by the.
08;04;46;08 – 08;04;45;09
Aaron
River. I love it.
08;04;44;23 – 08;04;43;25
Rick
Backpacking and.
08;04;43;16 – 08;04;41;09
Aaron
Really looking forward to that special time with her.
08;04;40;25 – 08;04;37;14
Aaron
That’s excellent. And so I’ve never been where you’re going. You know it is. I’m sorry to.
08;04;37;14 – 08;04;35;20
Aaron
Interrupt or an adventure.
08;04;34;23 – 08;04;31;13
Jon
And you mentioned, did you mention that something bigger than life happens adventure?
08;04;31;09 – 08;04;25;28
Rick
It is. Yeah, we chose to do a band life or has a sink and that maybe a little.
08;04;25;28 – 08;04;23;18
Aaron
Bit of storage and there are equipment in there, but.
08;04;23;05 – 08;04;19;05
Rick
We’ve never done that either. So everything is totally unexpected.
08;04;19;05 – 08;04;16;28
Aaron
We’re just going to, you know, where we’re.
08;04;16;18 – 08;04;15;20
Rick
Plopped down, where we.
08;04;15;20 – 08;04;12;04
Aaron
Want to stay for the night and then uproot and go to the next.
08;04;12;04 – 08;04;06;05
Aaron
one. Excellent shout out Billy ceremony in Texas and best practices for us to pass on to Rick.
08;04;06;04 – 08;04;00;20
Aaron
That’s right. Any tips are welcome. You do not.
08;04;00;07 – 08;03;55;16
Aaron
Have your battery go. That’s one of the ones we got. So let’s make sure that batteries charged up.
08;03;54;10 – 08;03;53;29
Aaron
Yeah.
08;03;53;12 – 08;03;51;09
Aaron
Excellent. So we’re this episode ten and.
08;03;50;15 – 08;03;49;22
Jon
This is episode.
08;03;49;21 – 08;03;33;18
Aaron
eleven, twelve, second episode eleven. And so we’re checking on you. We’ve had some fantastic guys. Yes, so far. And we’ve just been loving what we’ve been learning. Rick, I also want to mention that you run a coaching consulting group, right?
08;03;33;04 – 08;03;30;03
Aaron
And so you you call yourself a leadership survival guide.
08;03;29;29 – 08;03;18;00
Rick
Yeah. Right. I don’t like the title consultant or coach only because of so bland. And so I was talking with friends and because of beyond survival is.
08;03;18;00 – 08;03;06;09
Aaron
The name of our organization. They’re like, What would you do something with survival guide or something like that? And I was like, All right, I’ll try out. Leadership survival guide for a while to see if that sticks or is it too cheesy or whatever.
08;03;05;19 – 08;03;03;23
Rick
So I enjoy coaching.
08;03;03;23 – 08;03;02;28
Aaron
Leaders one on.
08;03;02;28 – 08;03;01;23
Rick
one and.
08;03;01;23 – 08;02;58;16
Aaron
Helping teams the direction of the leadership team retreats.
08;02;57;14 – 08;02;56;20
Rick
Helping businesses.
08;02;56;20 – 08;02;48;24
Aaron
Scale. I use that with some of my Strat ops training and also being an executive pastor for many years.
08;02;47;20 – 08;02;46;10
Rick
But mostly, I want to help.
08;02;46;02 – 08;02;42;21
Aaron
People in organizations go from just surviving but thriving.
08;02;42;14 – 08;02;41;21
Rick
And that is.
08;02;41;21 – 08;02;39;27
Aaron
Different in everyone’s different contexts.
08;02;39;25 – 08;02;36;23
Rick
Yes. And and as you know, and leading in business.
08;02;36;23 – 08;02;26;27
Aaron
There’s ups and downs in people’s personal life. There’s ups and downs. And so it’s a two pronged approach meaning personal, professional or highly integrated, not separated.
08;02;26;27 – 08;02;23;18
Rick
And just really helping people gain skills.
08;02;23;06 – 08;02;20;00
Aaron
So that they feel like they’re thriving and not just a threat.
08;02;19;16 – 08;02;08;07
Aaron
That’s outside. That’s why I like that leadership survival guide, because it kind of gives us feeling like when you’re in leadership, it’s sometimes I feel like and I’m going to get it through this year is the higher up you go.
08;02;08;07 – 08;01;56;17
Aaron
And we all like, you know, as we were young, we were like, Oh, I always want to be the boss or something, and then you are. You go, Man, this is rough. I mean, you’re you’re the point of contact for everything and the ones that you’re the one that gets.
08;01;56;17 – 08;01;49;29
Aaron
All the accolades seem very few in contrast to how many things you’re quote messing up.
08;01;49;23 – 08;01;49;11
Aaron
Right? Yeah.
08;01;49;00 – 08;01;32;14
Jon
Leadership’s always sexy from a distance. And yet when you combine the strong leadership from God with the beyond survival, you can kind of get a tease of. You’re going for their record keeping should be for everyone listening in to shroud, unsubscribe operations, finance or training, OK?
08;01;32;06 – 08;01;23;07
Jon
And then types of organizations that you’re primarily working with and locations of said organizations. Can you provide some context there? Absolutely. Donut shops.
08;01;23;04 – 08;01;19;18
Aaron
Oh yeah. Not yet.
08;01;18;29 – 08;01;16;20
Aaron
Anyone who’s doing donuts let me know.
08;01;15;21 – 08;01;06;12
Rick
It’s it has fallen into three categories model small to medium business leaders. This nonprofit leaders and in.
08;01;05;24 – 08;01;02;02
Aaron
Particular, church staff and church dynamics. And so.
08;01;01;13 – 08;01;00;03
Rick
The small businesses.
08;00;59;27 – 08;00;44;21
Aaron
Those people who are in startups or their business is going really well and they’re getting overwhelmed by all the volume and internally scale. Learn how to scale or they’re just not doing that because they’re stuck doing all the things they don’t want to do versus the things they’re most passionate about.
08;00;44;21 – 08;00;42;00
Aaron
They’re kind of why they started the business in the first place.
08;00;41;02 – 08;00;38;22
Rick
The nonprofit runs a.
08;00;38;15 – 08;00;29;28
Aaron
Startup, and the other one is go on for a while and growing and about ready to scale again. So just needing help structure focus on the most important things.
08;00;28;23 – 08;00;27;01
Rick
And then churches is different dynamics.
08;00;27;01 – 08;00;12;05
Aaron
It can be from leadership development or, as the church head is, it can be the communications pathways, engagement pathways, staff development, culture and just everything I’ve done as an executive pastor is pretty transferable to most churches.
08;00;12;03 – 09;59;58;00
Aaron
Wow. So have you felt like as you sat down with people that you know, if they’re calling you, they’re you know, most of the I mean, me personally, from a leadership perspective, it’s hard for me to be proactive.
09;59;57;16 – 09;59;47;12
Aaron
It’s like by the time I’m calling you, I’m like, I’m in it, you know, is there? Do you feel like you’ve been surprised by anything or is it kind of common what the problems are?
09;59;45;18 – 09;59;43;04
Rick
It’s it’s both because every.
09;59;43;04 – 09;59;40;20
Aaron
Business is unique. Every leader is unique.
09;59;40;19 – 09;59;39;12
Rick
So the dynamics.
09;59;39;09 – 09;59;36;17
Aaron
Of what’s affecting their life are what’s most important to.
09;59;36;17 – 09;59;30;21
Rick
Them is unique, but volume is not unique. So, you know, we.
09;59;30;21 – 09;59;28;12
Aaron
Have this water jar.
09;59;28;12 – 09;59;26;19
Rick
In front of me. It can only hold.
09;59;26;19 – 09;59;19;12
Aaron
Certain amount of hours in the second quarter. As much as I want to do it, it’s going to do everywhere. If I want more water, I need a bigger fucking or something.
09;59;18;26 – 09;59;18;01
Rick
And so there’s.
09;59;18;00 – 09;59;15;21
Aaron
A there’s a theory called a theory of constraints.
09;59;15;15 – 09;59;13;16
Rick
In science, and that.
09;59;13;16 – 09;59;10;07
Aaron
Theory basically just.
09;59;08;24 – 09;59;04;00
Rick
Tells us that, you know, this water jug is is constrained by the.
09;59;04;00 – 09;58;58;13
Aaron
Way it’s made. If you want. If you want more throughput, then you have to create different ways to make that happen.
09;58;58;12 – 09;58;52;11
Rick
So in a business, if someone was not doing slow melodic growth and then all.
09;58;52;11 – 09;58;51;03
Aaron
Of a sudden exploded.
09;58;49;21 – 09;58;48;27
Rick
And there are a.
09;58;48;18 – 09;58;46;15
Aaron
Ton of meetings each day working on their days off.
09;58;45;14 – 09;58;41;24
Rick
King, the mailbox just keeps growing. All these things.
09;58;41;24 – 09;58;40;16
Aaron
Are great signs of.
09;58;40;16 – 09;58;39;01
Rick
Volume and things that are happening.
09;58;39;01 – 09;58;35;20
Aaron
In our business. But on the flip side, that are being burnt out.
09;58;35;19 – 09;58;34;21
Rick
And so that means.
09;58;34;21 – 09;58;18;17
Aaron
That there are systems that you’re using to accomplish what matters most to them to do. Their business isn’t working. So when I talk to someone, they’re either in extreme disarray or so excited that that opportunity is overwhelming. It’s not usually anything in between.
09;58;18;02 – 09;58;16;23
Rick
So the pain is too great.
09;58;16;00 – 09;58;13;18
Aaron
Or the success is overwhelming.
09;58;12;10 – 09;58;11;16
Rick
And I think those are.
09;58;11;16 – 09;58;10;10
Aaron
two motivators already.
09;58;10;07 – 09;58;05;02
Aaron
Just honestly is a great motivator. Yeah. And if you’re an entrepreneur, you’re like, Oh, I can help.
09;58;04;26 – 09;58;04;10
Aaron
I can do it.
09;58;04;10 – 09;58;01;19
Rick
So you’re going to you’re going to keep trying to get.
09;58;01;19 – 09;58;00;03
Aaron
Up early or stay up later.
09;57;59;14 – 09;57;54;20
Rick
You’re going to sacrifice your days off. You’re going to do the hustle, but be in the rat race.
09;57;54;18 – 09;57;52;23
Aaron
Kind of funny how we recreate forever.
09;57;51;21 – 09;57;48;05
Rick
But at the end of the day, you just start coming to your end that, you.
09;57;48;05 – 09;57;47;04
Aaron
Know, you can’t do it all.
09;57;46;16 – 09;57;44;16
Rick
And there’s this great books out.
09;57;44;16 – 09;57;43;26
Aaron
There, and there’s.
09;57;42;20 – 09;57;41;19
Rick
Great wisdom that.
09;57;41;11 – 09;57;36;27
Aaron
Mentors that can just share about how you can lead your business differently.
09;57;35;29 – 09;57;17;06
Aaron
You’ve been the conversations that I’ve had with you over the years. You’re very enticing. Might just do more work harder all the time is that you you are a lot more. You hear a lot more intentional, which I’ve always appreciated about you and adding is not always the solution.
09;57;17;03 – 09;57;03;29
Aaron
Sometimes it’s rarely seems like it seems like now you go, look at what you’re doing right now, you to say, Are you the right guy? Are you? Are you even? You’re pouring in. But have you changed the systems containing it?
09;57;03;26 – 09;57;01;06
Rick
Yeah. Well, the reason why I’m.
09;57;01;06 – 09;56;58;10
Aaron
Intentional now is because in my thirties, I wasn’t.
09;56;57;15 – 09;56;53;01
Rick
And so the thirties I was blowing and going and.
09;56;51;28 – 09;56;47;22
Aaron
Thought I was having a heart attack in the church office so that.
09;56;47;11 – 09;56;43;22
Aaron
This is literal. This is really, you know, you’re not just talking.
09;56;43;18 – 09;56;40;17
Rick
No, no, no, no, no. So so yeah, I came back.
09;56;40;17 – 09;56;39;25
Aaron
From lunch.
09;56;39;25 – 09;56;37;17
Rick
And had this tension in.
09;56;37;17 – 09;56;37;04
Aaron
My.
09;56;35;27 – 09;56;30;12
Rick
I don’t know what, but in my chest went to my colleague and said, Hey, do you have any Tums?
09;56;30;03 – 09;56;20;29
Aaron
You know, I don’t know what’s going on. And he gave me some poems and I had like four and shoot them up in about ten minutes later. It was worse. And then I went back to him and said.
09;56;20;25 – 09;56;20;07
Rick
You know, those.
09;56;20;07 – 09;56;18;23
Aaron
Usually work pretty quickly as.
09;56;18;13 – 09;56;06;23
Rick
They do for me, but you don’t look too good. And I’m like, What do you mean? It’s like you kind of looking pale and green. And while he was saying that it was getting tighter. And he’s like, I think I need to.
09;56;06;23 – 09;56;05;01
Aaron
Call 911. And I was like, No.
09;56;04;04 – 09;56;02;20
Rick
You know, and then it just got.
09;56;02;17 – 09;56;01;08
Aaron
Worse and worse. And so he.
09;56;01;08 – 09;55;58;04
Rick
Called 911. Another body that.
09;55;58;04 – 09;55;48;19
Aaron
Was on staff was a previously empty, so he’s taking my pulse and they’re like, You need to lay down. And I literally think I’m going to die. So I’m like, I’m not lying down.
09;55;48;02 – 09;55;46;05
Aaron
And I don’t know what’s going on. I’m staying up.
09;55;45;17 – 09;55;43;06
Rick
And so the ambulance.
09;55;43;06 – 09;55;41;05
Aaron
Arrives, the EMT that’s like.
09;55;40;29 – 09;55;40;05
Rick
You know, read.
09;55;40;05 – 09;55;38;09
Aaron
Your heart and they give me aspirin.
09;55;37;19 – 09;55;36;01
Rick
And taken vital.
09;55;36;01 – 09;55;29;25
Aaron
Signs and so forth. And then it just stopped immediately. Just like relented.
09;55;29;03 – 09;55;22;23
Rick
And I was like, so relieved, and then the guy the EMT was like, How are you feeling?
09;55;22;23 – 09;55;20;12
Aaron
I was like, Wait until challenger disaster really works.
09;55;19;00 – 09;55;18;07
Aaron
Let’s call it up.
09;55;17;21 – 09;55;16;14
Rick
And he’s like, Well, your.
09;55;16;13 – 09;55;10;10
Aaron
Numbers don’t look too good. We got to take you in the ambulance. And I was like, OK, whatever you need to do, I’m doing.
09;55;09;19 – 09;55;06;13
Rick
And you know, I’m feeling so alive.
09;55;06;13 – 09;55;01;24
Aaron
Because I was so fearful of dying and watching. Just turn the siren on to war, you know.
09;55;01;04 – 09;55;00;14
Rick
Like, no, you’re.
09;55;00;14 – 09;54;57;28
Aaron
Not in an emergency. And I go into.
09;54;57;28 – 09;54;48;16
Aaron
The fear we all we’re going to tell me I’m dying to show up. That’s right. Go to lieutenant. Please make this more exciting. Yeah, more and more.
09;54;47;11 – 09;54;46;14
Rick
But that.
09;54;46;14 – 09;54;44;28
Aaron
Experience, when.
09;54;44;28 – 09;54;44;14
Rick
My wife.
09;54;44;14 – 09;54;39;24
Aaron
Walked into the room, I looked at her and I said, Disney doesn’t get any clearer than this.
09;54;38;29 – 09;54;34;06
Rick
And I just knew that how I was living life, particularly, I think the job.
09;54;34;00 – 09;54;27;05
Aaron
Was hard on me and how I was allowing it to be hard on me, so. That experience took me on a different journey.
09;54;26;23 – 09;54;25;00
Rick
And it turned out to be spasms of.
09;54;25;00 – 09;54;16;10
Aaron
The esophagus, which I’m told uses all the nerves that your heart would use in a heart attack, so obviously got to experience a heart attack without having twice.
09;54;15;27 – 09;54;14;16
Rick
And I stayed the night in.
09;54;14;16 – 09;54;09;10
Aaron
The hospital and I did a stress test on blah blah to make sure I could leave.
09;54;07;07 – 09;54;04;23
Rick
But it changed me in that I.
09;54;04;23 – 09;54;02;16
Aaron
Am not regulating myself very well and.
09;54;02;07 – 09;54;01;14
Rick
My body.
09;54;01;14 – 09;54;00;05
Aaron
Is telling me something.
09;54;00;05 – 09;53;58;26
Rick
That my mind was.
09;53;58;25 – 09;53;53;10
Aaron
Telling. It was doing other things and I was pressing it to the limit where it says enough.
09;53;53;04 – 09;53;49;03
Rick
And so I laid myself.
09;53;49;03 – 09;53;44;06
Aaron
Off a week later and that our staff was going through layoffs at the time.
09;53;44;04 – 09;53;41;15
Rick
And. Laura and I had.
09;53;41;15 – 09;53;31;04
Aaron
Already had an anniversary trip planned that weekend. So that happened on a Monday released on a Tuesday. We went up to and like on her Colorado on a Saturday.
09;53;30;06 – 09;53;29;11
Rick
And we’re like, we don’t have.
09;53;29;11 – 09;53;26;05
Aaron
A job, but we know that this time is ending, so we.
09;53;25;26 – 09;53;18;08
Rick
Resigned. And I started a new journey and I was handed a book called Leading on.
09;53;18;08 – 09;53;00;05
Aaron
Empty by Wayne Cordeiro from a friend. And I just drink that book up because it’s basically his journey of burnout. And I just resonated with it. And out of that book, birth of a new philosophy that I started living and trying.
09;53;00;05 – 09;52;59;15
Aaron
And so.
09;52;58;18 – 09;52;57;07
Rick
That journey started.
09;52;57;07 – 09;52;52;07
Aaron
Me on a journey of intentionality and learning boundaries and how to regulate myself.
09;52;52;05 – 09;52;50;16
Rick
And in the.
09;52;50;16 – 09;52;45;10
Aaron
Order of things I said was most valuable, but they and they in reality weren’t being able.
09;52;44;13 – 09;52;19;15
Aaron
So you. There’s someone out there is wondering because we talk about not quitting. And what you did was you’re you’re quitting. But it wasn’t like you weren’t throwing your hands up like it was their problem. That was I think that’s the real difference here because we can leave a job and go the jobs that yeah, but you
09;52;19;15 – 09;52;14;18
Aaron
you’re saying, I’m not. There’s something wrong with how I’m running.
09;52;14;02 – 09;52;11;04
Rick
If I’m a victim, I can say it’s the job and they did this.
09;52;11;04 – 09;52;08;02
Aaron
And I’m sure there were emotions there, but.
09;52;06;23 – 09;52;05;27
Rick
As I’ve gotten.
09;52;05;27 – 09;51;59;26
Aaron
Older, I realize I’m responsible for me. I’m responsible for my emotions, are responsible for my decisions.
09;51;59;26 – 09;51;57;28
Rick
And the reality.
09;51;57;28 – 09;51;57;14
Aaron
Was.
09;51;57;06 – 09;51;54;25
Rick
I wasn’t choosing to.
09;51;54;22 – 09;51;49;26
Aaron
Draw lines in the sand and have boundaries, and I wasn’t honoring what I said was most important.
09;51;49;04 – 09;51;47;20
Rick
And I was allowing other.
09;51;47;20 – 09;51;42;22
Aaron
Conflicts to happen. I was just sacrificing the things that was most important to me.
09;51;41;09 – 09;51;40;23
Rick
And I was.
09;51;40;23 – 09;51;39;27
Aaron
Paying the price.
09;51;39;00 – 09;51;33;13
Aaron
So what was being, what was being put aside? What were the.
09;51;33;13 – 09;51;29;26
Rick
Family? You know, something came up and I need.
09;51;29;26 – 09;51;21;25
Aaron
To meet with someone. I’ve sacrificed an evening to do that, whether it was mission critical or not, and most likely wasn’t.
09;51;20;25 – 09;51;19;17
Rick
Sometimes weekends.
09;51;19;17 – 09;51;17;03
Aaron
Weekend can just as kind of rolling.
09;51;16;25 – 09;51;15;00
Rick
And running, all for the sake of good.
09;51;15;00 – 09;51;12;27
Aaron
Things happening, other people.
09;51;12;26 – 09;51;07;27
Rick
But in my opinion, my family at that.
09;51;07;27 – 09;51;06;05
Aaron
Time was just four little ones.
09;51;06;04 – 09;51;04;00
Rick
You know, was being.
09;51;04;00 – 09;51;00;28
Aaron
Sacrificed, but a lot more burden of war.
09;50;59;00 – 09;50;56;03
Rick
And just missing out on things. And so some of it was.
09;50;56;03 – 09;50;51;10
Aaron
Maybe a way to. Adapt or.
09;50;49;22 – 09;50;49;09
Rick
Kind of.
09;50;49;00 – 09;50;45;25
Aaron
Deflect what was going on or like things were too hard.
09;50;44;18 – 09;50;43;17
Aaron
Or right, that.
09;50;43;17 – 09;50;40;23
Rick
Kind of thing, but the cumulative effect.
09;50;40;02 – 09;50;39;05
Aaron
Is what was really.
09;50;38;28 – 09;50;26;07
Aaron
Hurting. A lot of guys do that. I think it’s like, it’s easy. Yeah, work is easy. Don’t kid yourself. I’m tired. It’s really hard. It’s like it’s not as hard as some of your family. Yeah. Change your schedule up.
09;50;25;27 – 09;50;25;17
Aaron
Yeah.
09;50;24;25 – 09;50;18;28
Rick
And we did things as a family. It’s just I don’t I think I bought into the.
09;50;18;28 – 09;50;15;08
Aaron
Lie that if you’re going to be successful, whatever that was.
09;50;14;10 – 09;50;13;17
Rick
That you only.
09;50;13;17 – 09;50;02;21
Aaron
Have to do the hustle. And so the rat race in my mind was burning me out. It wasn’t necessarily bringing about the fruit that I wanted.
09;50;02;14 – 09;50;00;28
Rick
And living differently.
09;50;00;20 – 09;49;55;20
Aaron
I’m way more content with what I’m experiencing now and.
09;49;54;17 – 09;49;54;03
Rick
You know.
09;49;53;10 – 09;49;49;25
Aaron
Methodical success to me is is a win as well.
09;49;49;01 – 09;49;28;23
Jon
Well, there’s an important distinction going to be in that think it’s bound in who is defining success, right? And what the heck is the success? You know, if you allow your culture, your peers or whatever to define success, then I think you find yourself more in that position that you’re describing until you take that intentional step to
09;49;28;23 – 09;49;10;11
Jon
say, no, I’m going to define successes for myself. And once you do, that frees you right. It frees you to be able to redefine your life and what the pursuit of those things will be. And in doing so kind of accomplished some things for where I think the conversation is going to go away from the am I
09;49;10;10 – 09;49;04;11
Jon
having a heart attack to a more balanced existence that still high yield and high producing?
09;49;01;29 – 09;48;53;05
Aaron
You talk about exercising and dieting, but your body is having a physiological response to just emotional. Yeah, it’s a whole nother level that.
09;48;53;05 – 09;48;52;18
Rick
Is derived.
09;48;52;17 – 09;48;46;24
Aaron
From an effect on me was, you know, I didn’t necessarily realize what I chose to ignore.
09;48;45;29 – 09;48;44;21
Rick
And there was.
09;48;44;05 – 09;48;40;10
Aaron
A paragraph in the leading on MTV that says.
09;48;39;21 – 09;48;39;02
Rick
85.
09;48;39;02 – 09;48;33;27
Aaron
Percent of what you and I do, somebody else can do. And when I read that at first I was like.
09;48;32;16 – 09;48;32;06
Aaron
You know.
09;48;31;24 – 09;48;28;05
Rick
And it was it was a revelation of my, I.
09;48;28;05 – 09;48;27;07
Aaron
Think, my four eyes.
09;48;27;05 – 09;48;25;16
Rick
And then, he says, with enough.
09;48;25;14 – 09;48;17;19
Aaron
Educational experience, another 10% of your life someone else can do. But there’s really only 5% of your life that only you can do.
09;48;17;02 – 09;48;15;29
Rick
Any work down.
09;48;15;22 – 09;48;00;25
Aaron
Only you can be should be the husband to your wife when you can be the dad to your kids. Or you can be the friend to your friends. Only you can regulate your health and all. You can have your spiritual walks.
09;48;00;25 – 09;47;59;04
Aaron
Okay, have it for you, right?
09;47;58;23 – 09;47;57;10
Rick
And so that’s.
09;47;56;06 – 09;47;47;18
Aaron
Reality. After I’ve marinated it on it for a while and thought about it was actually, I think he’s right in those five areas.
09;47;46;10 – 09;47;40;08
Rick
I’m not proud of. Honestly. So I took that framework.
09;47;39;27 – 09;47;35;15
Aaron
That 5% framework and I just started practicing it.
09;47;34;04 – 09;47;32;04
Rick
Been trying to do it well.
09;47;31;16 – 09;47;19;09
Aaron
And I would set a sheet with what I’d hope that would happen in each one of those areas and this kind of group. It’s one of the tools I use and coaching others like How are you in these areas?
09;47;19;09 – 09;47;05;23
Aaron
Are you? Are you thriving or experiencing the life? With your wife, with your kiddos, in your health and spiritual walk, and particularly in your friendships, because this thing to erode as you get older.
09;47;05;21 – 09;46;47;13
Aaron
Right? The Nintendo Yeah. And John, you’re saying setting those priorities like that when you do the priorities and you think about a 5% situation like where you get real, feel about it, what only can I do? Well, there’s your list and you have to guard it.
09;46;47;03 – 09;46;34;24
Jon
There’s it’s kind of like the second mountain, right? So there’s this wonderful book by David Brooks called The second Mountain and the entire premises. You know, even my culture kind of shown this. You know what success looks like.
09;46;34;24 – 09;46;17;07
Jon
It’s, you know, getting a salary. It’s accomplishing its status. You know, getting married, buying your house, all these things. Well, if you’re ambitious and you’re driven, you accomplish those things fairly early, right? And now where you climb out of certain things, you know, maybe you’re in a in a position where you have to go further to get
09;46;17;06 – 09;46;02;20
Jon
those things done right. But at some point, once you accomplish that, you, regardless of your age, you kind of hit this like, So what? Now I’m here. What’s coming next? You know, and that’s where it’s interesting because you look at the Olympic athletes from a football player to win the Super Bowl.
09;46;01;16 – 09;45;50;21
Jon
If they’re not mentally prepared for this just being a milestone and not the end state, they hit this period of depression and there’s a lot of stories that surround that’s true in business, like anywhere where there is a finish line find.
09;45;50;19 – 09;45;36;18
Jon
Yeah. If they see that as like their point of being, everything is focused on accomplishing that all. And there’s not the perspective that this is milestone. And when they hit that, this explosion of sitting there? Yes. And then they’re going to shower and the high comes down.
09;45;36;08 – 09;45;18;20
Jon
No. Wait. Now what? What’s my purpose? What am I doing after this concept of the second mountain? Because it’s like, OK, you accomplished the things you need to do to have a fairly stable existence, right? You are. Quote unquote successful by most, by most terms.
09;45;18;04 – 09;45;06;14
Jon
Now let me know what is going to drive you to continue living in this, you know? And then I hear a lot of that in your five or 5%. I mean, which I love is like, how are these relationships right?
09;45;05;29 – 09;44;46;03
Jon
Because if if you’re successful enough that you’re not worried about necessity and your relationships are, well, now, you’re really poised to not only find an ideal worth spending your life in the pursuit of, but actually pursuing it in that ideal becomes that second marriage in that framework that we just described.
09;44;46;02 – 09;44;45;11
Aaron
It’s really good.
09;44;45;06 – 09;44;44;00
Rick
And you bring up a point.
09;44;42;12 – 09;44;41;25
Aaron
Where.
09;44;41;10 – 09;44;40;02
Rick
With success is usually.
09;44;40;02 – 09;44;25;09
Aaron
Measured in pass or fail, you either accomplish that or did it. And I feel like it’s important with the 5% something I try to add. It’s later on. It’s like it’s not. Is my relationship with law a pass or fail or a number one through five?
09;44;25;09 – 09;44;23;18
Aaron
It’s really is it red, yellow or green?
09;44;22;19 – 09;44;21;01
Rick
Red means it’s not doing well.
09;44;21;01 – 09;44;18;10
Aaron
Something’s broken. We’re actually, well yellow as.
09;44;17;21 – 09;44;15;08
Rick
We’re doing pretty good, but it’s not. It’s not the best.
09;44;15;05 – 09;44;10;10
Aaron
Maybe sometimes sputtering along and then claim we’re having a thriving marriage we enjoy.
09;44;09;25 – 09;44;03;16
Rick
It doesn’t mean that you don’t have hardships, and I just think in life those five areas could become.
09;44;03;08 – 09;44;01;28
Aaron
Sometimes I approach leaders.
09;44;01;08 – 09;43;59;12
Rick
And they and I send them my five.
09;43;59;12 – 09;43;54;04
Aaron
Percent list so they can see as an example, I was not for you to top yourself to help spur your thoughts on.
09;43;53;18 – 09;43;49;22
Rick
But it’s not goal setting per se, meaning I need to work.
09;43;49;22 – 09;43;47;26
Aaron
Out three times a week for my health plan.
09;43;47;17 – 09;43;45;24
Rick
You may need to, but is that truly.
09;43;45;24 – 09;43;44;25
Aaron
Life giving to you?
09;43;44;05 – 09;43;41;25
Rick
Because if you’re not doing life, giving things in those.
09;43;41;25 – 09;43;37;21
Aaron
Lines will just become a burden, then back into success or fail.
09;43;37;00 – 09;43;29;02
Rick
Lane versus, you know, Lauren, I love the beach. How do we get to the beach together? That that would be a win, and it’s something that.
09;43;29;02 – 09;43;24;28
Aaron
Helps our relationship and we just grow closer together with my.
09;43;24;28 – 09;43;21;05
Rick
Kiddos. It might be, you know, throwing the.
09;43;21;05 – 09;43;18;01
Aaron
Ball out in the backyard of our bar. Something’s on the grill.
09;43;18;01 – 09;43;17;24
Rick
And.
09;43;17;24 – 09;43;07;10
Aaron
Catching up on your day. That’s very life giving to me. I assume it is to them. But that’s the reason why I like to do it is because I enjoy hearing what’s going on in their life and is refreshing to me.
09;43;06;22 – 09;43;04;29
Rick
But it would be a fail.
09;43;04;29 – 09;42;58;17
Aaron
If I said two times I have to go for the ball in the back and I don’t really care. But that’s what being a good dad. You know.
09;42;57;22 – 09;42;52;16
Rick
I think that’s nice because you’re making time, but it’s not fully rooted.
09;42;52;16 – 09;42;45;11
Aaron
It’s an authentic because it’s complementary versus I really want to spend time. I want to spend time with my friends.
09;42;44;29 – 09;42;44;05
Rick
I want to make sure.
09;42;44;05 – 09;42;37;01
Aaron
That there’s a monthly time on our calendar that we know we can count on, that we’re going in together if that’s what it takes for us to cross paths.
09;42;36;25 – 09;42;13;12
Aaron
I’m going to ask a question for me. Can you say that? What is how do you identify the difference between unknowable life-giving thing and one that maybe you should think about releasing, you know, because you might somebody say, you know, a life giving for me is going away every weekend for fishing trips when they have a family
09;42;13;12 – 09;42;03;00
Aaron
back home or, yeah, you know, how do you temper? Making sure you get the life giving, make sure you’re getting filled up as an individual, but at the same time doing what you’re supposed to be doing.
09;42;03;00 – 09;42;01;28
Aaron
Get the correct question.
09;42;01;28 – 09;41;56;20
Rick
And I think you’ll hear me say a lot. It’s both right, because if you were to measure.
09;41;56;20 – 09;41;50;01
Aaron
Regular green and you’re going fishing every Saturday, you know, how are you pouring into your family?
09;41;49;09 – 09;41;42;29
Rick
Maybe you are on a Tuesday night and a Thursday night. It just depends on your rhythm. And I think this is.
09;41;42;29 – 09;41;42;10
Aaron
Where.
09;41;41;17 – 09;41;41;04
Rick
Divine.
09;41;41;04 – 09;41;37;29
Aaron
Design comes into play. And wearing your own armor.
09;41;37;04 – 09;41;35;28
Rick
There’s a lot of things in life.
09;41;35;28 – 09;41;27;23
Aaron
We’re just placed on those that you ought to do this and you have to do this. And I think some of those are based on religious principles. And then, you know, there’s some wisdom in there.
09;41;27;01 – 09;41;24;27
Rick
But then on the flip side, you’re unique.
09;41;24;05 – 09;41;21;01
Aaron
God’s designs are unique. There’s a divine design in you.
09;41;21;01 – 09;41;19;10
Rick
And and I.
09;41;19;10 – 09;41;11;15
Aaron
Believe those those passions, those preferences, those dreams are uniquely yours. We might have some similar points.
09;41;10;25 – 09;41;09;03
Rick
And so to me, customizing.
09;41;09;03 – 09;41;04;27
Aaron
How you accomplish what’s most important to you, according to you.
09;41;04;00 – 09;41;03;15
Rick
Or I.
09;41;03;15 – 09;41;01;04
Aaron
Heard a phrase that says, you know.
09;41;01;01 – 09;41;00;05
Rick
Do more things that.
09;41;00;05 – 09;40;57;22
Aaron
Help you feel like who you are.
09;40;56;29 – 09;40;56;17
Rick
And it’s.
09;40;56;17 – 09;40;55;19
Aaron
Just like, All.
09;40;55;19 – 09;40;55;01
Rick
Right, how do.
09;40;55;01 – 09;40;53;03
Aaron
I play to my strengths in a sense?
09;40;52;15 – 09;40;50;06
Rick
So, you know, you do need to be.
09;40;50;06 – 09;40;48;20
Aaron
Able to go away guilt free.
09;40;47;27 – 09;40;44;14
Rick
And it be life giving. But it isn’t. It isn’t optional.
09;40;44;14 – 09;40;38;26
Aaron
That you live life giving wise and your life doesn’t write for an example. So it’s like, Well.
09;40;38;04 – 09;40;36;08
Rick
You know, what’s life giving to war and.
09;40;36;08 – 09;40;34;00
Aaron
How do I as a husband help through that for her.
09;40;33;10 – 09;40;30;11
Rick
Because we believe in life giving? So it might be.
09;40;30;02 – 09;40;20;19
Aaron
A 24 hour trip, just in a hotel or a girls trip, and that’s like giving to her and mine might be going with some guys, you know?
09;40;20;15 – 09;40;18;00
Rick
And to me, it’s not.
09;40;17;21 – 09;40;13;29
Aaron
Early on in marriage. It would be a tussle or negotiation.
09;40;13;18 – 09;40;08;21
Rick
It’s like whatever I do, I have to do this. And some of that, I think is fair is unfair that.
09;40;08;21 – 09;40;07;16
Aaron
The husband gets there thinking, that.
09;40;07;09 – 09;40;00;17
Rick
Doesn’t. But then on the flip side, I think. Man, when she’s in her life-giving lane, I benefit our family.
09;40;00;17 – 09;39;59;29
Aaron
Benefits.
09;39;59;09 – 09;39;58;29
Rick
And I.
09;39;58;29 – 09;39;55;16
Aaron
Want to see her alive just as much as I want to be alive.
09;39;55;01 – 09;39;53;23
Rick
But what makes that what.
09;39;53;23 – 09;39;52;16
Aaron
Makes her alive is different?
09;39;52;08 – 09;39;50;13
Rick
So customizing is.
09;39;50;07 – 09;39;48;27
Aaron
Is where I think escape is a.
09;39;48;27 – 09;39;36;11
Jon
Question for that. What if the partner doesn’t want to break away to do this life giving things? Have you experienced that and how do you hope? Overcome that for the benefits of reassessing.
09;39;36;03 – 09;39;32;22
Rick
Yeah, well, I think if it’s on mom not wanting.
09;39;32;22 – 09;39;23;23
Aaron
To pass away, I think some of us understanding who she is and some of the motives of why it could be like if I leave, there’ll be more work for me.
09;39;23;14 – 09;39;22;16
Rick
To do in academics.
09;39;22;15 – 09;39;20;04
Aaron
I like my life. You know, it’s not worth it.
09;39;20;03 – 09;39;14;15
Rick
The exchanges are worth it. Something that can be personality. You know, my wife is.
09;39;14;15 – 09;39;09;14
Aaron
Very detail oriented, perfectionist, law abiding citizen.
09;39;09;00 – 09;39;01;24
Rick
I’m not any of those things, but. And she will. You know, the belief is, you want something done.
09;39;01;20 – 09;38;59;18
Aaron
You get it. You do it yourself. You want it done well.
09;38;59;05 – 09;38;57;01
Rick
And I think, well, that’s.
09;38;57;01 – 09;38;52;05
Aaron
True if it’s just something I can control. But if it’s all in, this is unrealistic.
09;38;51;19 – 09;38;49;06
Rick
So to me, it’s kind of like, you know, what about.
09;38;49;06 – 09;38;47;19
Aaron
Bob baby steps in the law if.
09;38;47;16 – 09;38;46;11
Rick
Creating art? Let’s just.
09;38;46;11 – 09;38;44;11
Aaron
Try something to do, you know.
09;38;43;24 – 09;38;39;04
Rick
That then will help work because I’ve found and this is true of leaders.
09;38;39;04 – 09;38;38;17
Aaron
And coaching.
09;38;37;02 – 09;38;30;29
Rick
They can be overwhelmed, and a lot of them are high type type personalities.
09;38;30;29 – 09;38;26;29
Aaron
And this or a whatever the right terminology is.
09;38;26;29 – 09;38;26;02
Rick
And all the.
09;38;26;02 – 09;38;24;17
Aaron
Balloon strings are attached to them.
09;38;23;21 – 09;38;22;29
Rick
And the reality.
09;38;22;29 – 09;38;21;14
Aaron
Is, is they need to entrust.
09;38;20;25 – 09;38;19;12
Rick
But they’re scared that the.
09;38;19;12 – 09;38;15;21
Aaron
Systems that they entrusted or the person they entrusted to isn’t going to work.
09;38;15;07 – 09;38;14;23
Rick
The mines can.
09;38;14;23 – 09;38;13;29
Aaron
Create double work.
09;38;13;04 – 09;37;59;24
Rick
So to me, it’s like, All right, well, that’s fair because I understand that. So let’s let’s figure out a way to create some trust. So it is an all or nothing. Let’s take a few baby steps, small wins.
09;37;59;23 – 09;37;57;01
Aaron
I think a great book for this is called Atomic Habits.
09;37;55;16 – 09;37;52;13
Rick
And it’s just these little bitty steps that get you down the road.
09;37;52;07 – 09;37;50;02
Aaron
I find it so hard to go back to your question.
09;37;49;10 – 09;37;46;29
Rick
John, I would say, Well, I don’t want to have.
09;37;46;29 – 09;37;45;09
Aaron
To convince.
09;37;45;09 – 09;37;38;26
Rick
Everything right now, but I do know that there’s something. So it’s like I got the kids go.
09;37;38;25 – 09;37;30;08
Aaron
I already scheduled a hotel for you, whether you want to watch TV all day or have a friend or whatever. Your arrest or relax, we got this.
09;37;29;19 – 09;37;29;08
Rick
You know.
09;37;29;07 – 09;37;26;08
Aaron
High output, people sometimes just need to be told. Yeah.
09;37;25;22 – 09;37;23;01
Aaron
I just think there’s a trust in the fly in the system.
09;37;23;01 – 09;37;19;04
Rick
And and it has to be tested in in pity us if it fails.
09;37;19;04 – 09;37;18;17
Aaron
Right away.
09;37;18;14 – 09;37;13;00
Aaron
Mm hmm. Because then, yeah, because it just reinforces the belief. Yeah.
09;37;12;23 – 09;37;10;27
Rick
But but the reality is, is.
09;37;10;27 – 09;37;09;24
Aaron
That we’re all.
09;37;09;24 – 09;37;06;18
Rick
Finite. We’re all limited, limited.
09;37;06;18 – 09;37;03;11
Aaron
Willpower, limited emotions, limited strength, energy.
09;37;02;16 – 09;36;56;13
Rick
And you know, a man will reach the end of a rope and then she might.
09;36;56;13 – 09;36;50;16
Aaron
Be open to some. That’s where it goes back to that pain or that great success, or we’re willing to change how.
09;36;50;15 – 09;36;32;26
Jon
Much better to get there. Get ahead of that, right? Yeah. You mentioned the concept of trust me, I like it. I’ve always thought of it as delegation, which I think they’re synonymous in the context you described. It became them together, depending on your context, I think was kind of like, 00, I love love that.
09;36;31;08 – 09;36;15;03
Jon
But feeling the connotation of entrusting, you know, whether it’s in the home, it’s like, you know, growing your brain trust in me that kids are crying. We can get out of here, right? Or it’s I’m going to entrust my team member in the workplace to take on this project, right?
09;36;14;26 – 09;36;00;03
Jon
There’s. I imagine if it’s like, hey, here’s your new task versus have entrusted with this project. It almost imparts ownership in a way that’s not how wonderful. Yeah, it’s an empowering way of saying Here you go, which I really like.
09;35;59;26 – 09;35;59;10
Jon
Yeah, yeah.
09;35;58;06 – 09;35;50;05
Aaron
And its act of surrender on the leader to the mom or the dad or whatever secretary I’m going to yield to give us a go.
09;35;49;13 – 09;35;37;19
Aaron
Yeah. Wow. So that’s so when you look at those who are starting to burn out or they’re they’re coming to the end of themselves and we’re talking a little bit of strategy on how to combat that ahead of time.
09;35;36;27 – 09;35;24;06
Aaron
I like what you said about giving it, doing life, giving figure out what you have. That’s life giving and make sure you have those in there. Had a conversation prior to me that was like a lightbulb because I’m thinking what?
09;35;23;11 – 09;35;09;11
Aaron
I think a lot of guys will do this to itself. Just be like they’ll fall into what if I just do all the things I’m supposed to be doing, then that’s life. And then in there, it’s sort of like this martyrdom that you put out.
09;35;09;03 – 09;35;02;12
Aaron
It’s like five hours deny myself all the time, but it will catch up to you. Yeah, if you’re not giving anything back to yourself.
09;35;02;01 – 09;34;59;22
Rick
Yeah, there’s tons of.
09;34;59;22 – 09;34;56;19
Aaron
Writings and studies on energy and managing energy.
09;34;56;13 – 09;34;50;25
Rick
But I, I are beyond survival is kind of.
09;34;50;25 – 09;34;42;23
Aaron
Based off of a verse. John 1010, where it says the thief comes the steal can destroy. But I have come that you might have life and have it abundantly.
09;34;41;29 – 09;34;40;16
Rick
And I spent time thinking about what.
09;34;40;16 – 09;34;29;04
Aaron
Does that word life mean and what does abundance mean in my experiencing abundant life? Or am I just surviving as one right? And what you’re describing is more surviving, right?
09;34;28;25 – 09;34;22;21
Rick
And honestly, in my burnout journey, I didn’t really know what was life giving to me. So Laura and I both.
09;34;22;21 – 09;34;20;27
Aaron
Did this exercise. We took a piece of paper.
09;34;20;09 – 09;34;18;16
Rick
We drew a line down the middle and on the.
09;34;18;16 – 09;34;17;14
Aaron
Left side as like, write.
09;34;17;14 – 09;34;13;01
Rick
Everything that’s like giving every person geography place thing in.
09;34;13;01 – 09;34;11;24
Aaron
Our lives, its life giving.
09;34;11;00 – 09;34;09;19
Rick
And then on the other side.
09;34;09;05 – 09;34;06;29
Aaron
Everything that is life sucking and depleting.
09;34;05;14 – 09;34;03;09
Rick
Relationships, things, people.
09;34;03;00 – 09;34;01;08
Aaron
Responsibilities, whatever it was.
09;34;00;15 – 09;33;57;13
Rick
We did that separately and then we came together.
09;33;57;10 – 09;33;56;01
Aaron
So no peeking, no peeking.
09;33;55;25 – 09;33;54;17
Aaron
Yeah. You know, like why?
09;33;53;25 – 09;33;53;01
Aaron
I thought your.
09;33;51;29 – 09;33;48;12
Rick
It’s a side story. Help me remember to talk about.
09;33;47;28 – 09;33;46;00
Aaron
Someone I’m coaching that I had a good fight.
09;33;43;29 – 09;33;43;10
Rick
But anyway, that’s.
09;33;43;10 – 09;33;42;27
Aaron
Not the point.
09;33;42;14 – 09;33;40;22
Rick
The point is to identify what’s.
09;33;40;22 – 09;33;39;24
Aaron
Truly life giving.
09;33;39;16 – 09;33;38;17
Rick
And then the question.
09;33;38;17 – 09;33;35;14
Aaron
Was, are these things happening on a regular basis?
09;33;34;22 – 09;33;33;27
Rick
And then on.
09;33;33;27 – 09;33;29;05
Aaron
The life the fleeting and was. Is there anything on here that we can go ahead and get rid of right now today?
09;33;28;04 – 09;33;19;05
Jon
Well, I want to jump in real quick on that point because you can you categorize people in relationships in the life giving, life sucking.
09;33;19;00 – 09;33;15;06
Aaron
Mm-Hmm. So let’s just have some fun. All right.
09;33;14;06 – 09;32;57;19
Jon
So what I think that to me is that if you notice that there’s someone in the life giving side, then you want to continue to invest in foster that relationship if they’re on the life sucking side and you’re going to cease investing in that relationship.
09;32;57;16 – 09;32;55;14
Rick
Maybe you definitely if it’s.
09;32;55;14 – 09;32;54;01
Aaron
Personal relationships.
09;32;54;01 – 09;32;53;14
Rick
Meaning.
09;32;53;00 – 09;32;49;04
Aaron
Not work or other reasons why you’re.
09;32;48;26 – 09;32;45;05
Rick
In relationships with one another, then I would say yes, you don’t.
09;32;45;05 – 09;32;38;21
Aaron
Necessarily have to spend as much time in those relationships. Mm-Hmm. You know, everyone always brings up family.
09;32;38;17 – 09;32;37;12
Rick
Which I think is a.
09;32;37;10 – 09;32;35;25
Aaron
Is a real reality.
09;32;35;16 – 09;32;34;20
Rick
And depending on what.
09;32;34;20 – 09;32;33;28
Aaron
Families we come.
09;32;33;28 – 09;32;30;03
Rick
From. But I think there’s healthy boundaries with families.
09;32;30;03 – 09;32;26;09
Aaron
But if you’re just talking about friendships and where I spent our time, we go out to eat with.
09;32;25;23 – 09;32;23;14
Rick
And if it’s not life-giving, then then why are.
09;32;23;14 – 09;32;22;14
Aaron
You going to perpetuate it?
09;32;22;02 – 09;32;20;27
Rick
Now, here’s the.
09;32;20;27 – 09;32;19;27
Aaron
Caveat to it.
09;32;19;07 – 09;32;06;18
Rick
There are people that are put in my life and and and I’m put in their lives where it’s kind of a ministry oriented thing. It’s like, you know, they’re hard to be around, but they need someone.
09;32;06;15 – 09;32;04;14
Aaron
You can walk into what I feel called to be that.
09;32;03;24 – 09;32;02;24
Jon
Kind of part cheese thing.
09;32;02;19 – 09;31;58;04
Rick
Therefore, I choose to engage and I and I and I put it in a category of.
09;31;58;04 – 09;31;56;14
Aaron
Ministry and mentorship, which is.
09;31;56;14 – 09;31;54;01
Rick
OK, but it doesn’t necessarily mean we’re going to.
09;31;54;01 – 09;31;51;21
Aaron
Be closest friends. That would be unrealistic.
09;31;51;06 – 09;31;34;15
Jon
So, so based on that to I, probably the best way not to go too far down that path is a highlight what I just heard, and I think there’s some nuggets in it, right? So because managing relationships is difficult, but it’s definitely one of the higher finished items, you know, really more on the art side and the
09;31;34;13 – 09;31;19;17
Jon
side sides of an equation. So, you know, if it’s just a friend or just an acquaintance that you have no ties to unless you’re putting in an interest, life sucking and really questioning why you’re putting into that relationship, you can probably just see your efforts cease and desist.
09;31;19;15 – 09;31;02;18
Jon
Excuse me if if you’re bound to them for some reason, whether it be family or work, you know, there’s an added level of complexity there. And that’s where you just need to be incredibly intentional on defining, creating and adjusting probably mid-flight.
09;31;02;18 – 09;31;01;07
Jon
What healthy boundaries looks like.
09;31;00;18 – 09;30;56;24
Rick
Yeah, I would say another book I read.
09;30;56;24 – 09;30;52;10
Aaron
On the other side of my burnout was called Necessary Endings by Henry Cloud.
09;30;51;04 – 09;30;49;05
Rick
And I read that book to.
09;30;48;24 – 09;30;46;07
Aaron
two to three times a year. And here’s why.
09;30;46;06 – 09;30;44;18
Rick
It gives me objective.
09;30;44;18 – 09;30;38;27
Aaron
Criteria and how to navigate this tougher relationships. And it’s.
09;30;37;20 – 09;30;35;13
Rick
It is about boundaries, it’s about knowing when.
09;30;35;13 – 09;30;27;23
Aaron
You’re dealing with someone who’s foolish versus wise and even evil. It’s, you know, how do you determine something that’s helpful?
09;30;25;18 – 09;30;24;00
Rick
How do you how do you know when something is.
09;30;24;00 – 09;30;22;14
Aaron
Hurtful versus horrible?
09;30;22;02 – 09;30;20;22
Rick
You know, some things might be.
09;30;20;22 – 09;30;16;02
Aaron
Hurtful, but you’re going to heal from it. Things are hard for you to get away from it.
09;30;15;15 – 09;30;10;05
Rick
And so I think that takes time. And anytime you put those boundaries up, there’s going to be.
09;30;10;04 – 09;29;56;10
Aaron
Resistance to it. And I think that’s where some of the relational stress comes on early on in my life because I’m more of a peacemaker personality. I would absorb or relate to what others would want, and I would be the casualty of it.
09;29;55;24 – 09;29;55;05
Rick
And it was just.
09;29;55;05 – 09;29;46;11
Aaron
A pleasing me. More and more this tool this book, which is an easy read, really helped me with criteria of leadership.
09;29;46;08 – 09;29;43;26
Rick
But also in what’s really healthy.
09;29;43;21 – 09;29;42;27
Aaron
Healthy for me.
09;29;42;27 – 09;29;39;22
Rick
And when to call time of death.
09;29;39;22 – 09;29;35;01
Aaron
On something like there. There’s no reason for hope here. Why are you continually perpetuating? Mm-Hmm.
09;29;34;09 – 09;29;29;12
Rick
So I think that that to me, spending time in the chapters.
09;29;29;12 – 09;29;28;09
Aaron
In that book, really.
09;29;27;27 – 09;29;27;04
Rick
I know it shaped.
09;29;27;04 – 09;29;23;06
Aaron
Me, and I always recommend it to anyone I work with because it’s like.
09;29;22;26 – 09;29;21;19
Rick
You need objectivity.
09;29;21;04 – 09;29;18;18
Aaron
Because relationships are so emotional or subjective.
09;29;18;01 – 09;29;13;06
Jon
That’s wonderful. And really? I’m going to actually, I read that I’m going to read out.
09;29;12;13 – 09;29;03;21
Aaron
The toilet and try not to self-diagnosing, giving myself a list right now, trying to sort of be present right now, thinking through all the things like what’s on my list?
09;29;02;28 – 09;29;00;10
Jon
Yeah, I’m excited to do that exercise. I’m going to do that.
09;29;00;04 – 09;28;58;10
Aaron
That’s great. You and your spouse.
09;28;58;10 – 09;28;56;25
Jon
Said did separate and everything.
09;28;56;20 – 09;28;53;14
Aaron
So reminds me. Yeah, so the marriage one. Yes, I caught me off.
09;28;53;14 – 09;28;52;13
Rick
Guard because I’ve never.
09;28;52;13 – 09;28;51;29
Aaron
Had someone.
09;28;51;29 – 09;28;41;23
Rick
Say, you know, we went nuts. I tell her one. Take your list. Go out on a date. It’s a fun activity. And I guess whatever was on their list.
09;28;41;23 – 09;28;41;15
Aaron
Kind of.
09;28;40;29 – 09;28;31;07
Aaron
Triggered something and it was like I was a terrible exercise. You’re the first people I’ve ever heard. It’s just like, how about we.
09;28;30;03 – 09;28;27;03
Rick
Not point like, what you do as a.
09;28;27;03 – 09;28;24;14
Aaron
Wife is life sucking. Those things like, it’s not.
09;28;24;14 – 09;28;23;23
Aaron
Really the point.
09;28;22;29 – 09;28;20;01
Rick
You don’t take one person and do this with life giving and this.
09;28;20;01 – 09;28;17;20
Aaron
Is life sucking about you.
09;28;17;01 – 09;28;11;06
Rick
Life in general. So I think they kind of drill down a little bit, maybe a bit much, but it was insightful.
09;28;11;06 – 09;28;07;13
Aaron
For me to to here because I didn’t expect it, but also the things like, OK.
09;28;07;08 – 09;28;03;08
Rick
I can see how. You know, some tension points.
09;28;03;08 – 09;28;01;21
Aaron
In marriage where you’re like, I.
09;28;01;21 – 09;27;59;10
Rick
Want this. She hates.
09;27;59;10 – 09;27;57;20
Aaron
What I want and.
09;27;57;07 – 09;27;56;01
Rick
Now he’s choosing it.
09;27;56;01 – 09;27;53;03
Aaron
Over me, so therefore he loves that more than he loves me.
09;27;52;17 – 09;27;47;15
Rick
And that’s while actions might convey that it’s actually.
09;27;47;15 – 09;27;39;20
Aaron
Probably not true. He probably needs that to recover. Just happens to be something that she doesn’t want. She wants to talk about everything and he doesn’t.
09;27;39;00 – 09;27;37;06
Rick
And and his way of.
09;27;37;06 – 09;27;28;21
Aaron
Processing life is being eroded slowly over time. And so it still goes back to awareness. Right? Who are you? Where you are?
09;27;27;08 – 09;27;25;14
Rick
And how am I divinely designed?
09;27;25;14 – 09;27;22;08
Aaron
And then how do I play those strengths in making room for that?
09;27;22;05 – 09;27;21;14
Rick
And that’s tough.
09;27;21;14 – 09;27;19;00
Aaron
When you’re you don’t have the maturity to.
09;27;19;00 – 09;27;14;16
Aaron
Handle this conversation, as we have it with right.
09;27;13;24 – 09;26;52;29
Jon
It’s a on the verbal processor, my wife’s faith. I just want to be quiet. Yeah. Can you stop that? The third category just don’t want to lose sight of is right from the managing relationship aspect. Right is the well, there may be difficulty here, but I’m going to continue for this fight, right?
09;26;52;29 – 09;26;38;05
Jon
It’s an intentional choice of parameters. When you talked about how that could be mentorship, that could be potentially coaching or ministry as also thinking there’s there’s categories, right? Like this can’t just be a finite your life sucking right now.
09;26;38;05 – 09;26;25;26
Jon
Therefore, this is over. It’s such an ass because I have had the privilege and honor of walking through some pretty terrible times with people, and they’ve walked through some pretty terrible times with me. And that’s kind of like the flow.
09;26;25;26 – 09;26;09;04
Jon
I know I’m draining the life out of their soul during this, during those times, yeah, but they happily give it y quality. I think it creates the fourth dimension of that management thing. It’s like, Well, if you see value in the relationship, then you’re willing to go to hell with that person.
09;26;08;15 – 09;26;01;22
Jon
That’s but that’s not what it is, is intentional. That’s right. It’s an intentional choice.
09;26;01;22 – 09;26;01;09
Rick
And it’s.
09;26;01;09 – 09;26;00;24
Aaron
Testing.
09;26;00;04 – 09;25;55;05
Rick
Because that could be a crucial friendship moment. And if you make it on the other.
09;25;55;05 – 09;25;51;29
Aaron
Side, your bond is even tighter and stronger.
09;25;51;13 – 09;25;49;21
Aaron
Some friendships don’t make it.
09;25;49;21 – 09;25;41;24
Aaron
On the other side, and then it becomes one of those things where they don’t recover, regardless of what the the reasons or the topics. Mm hmm.
09;25;41;19 – 09;25;39;29
Rick
But if you’re a friend.
09;25;39;27 – 09;25;28;02
Aaron
I feel like that’s I mean, friendship is was really tested in the hard times who’s come alongside me when I need them most or even when maybe it’s shameful for them to do so? Kind of a thing.
09;25;27;15 – 09;25;25;20
Rick
And that’s where.
09;25;25;20 – 09;25;07;26
Aaron
You start forming those inner circle. So like the friendships on my 5% or not, everybody that I know, it’s the ones that I was with, the ones that are in the foxhole with me, the ones that you know, carry me, the ones that come and visit me when I’m in the hospital, the ones that, you know, watch
09;25;07;26 – 09;25;03;18
Aaron
our kids in an emergency or when my chart breaks down on the side of the road, they show up.
09;25;01;19 – 09;24;59;07
Rick
Those are the kind of life-giving friendships.
09;24;59;01 – 09;24;48;09
Aaron
Some some friendships to me are seasonal like life. Geographical could be seasonal, according to life circumstances. Occasional occasional.
09;24;48;07 – 09;24;47;09
Aaron
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
09;24;47;01 – 09;24;46;24
Rick
And you.
09;24;46;24 – 09;24;46;02
Aaron
Know, over time.
09;24;44;28 – 09;24;29;23
Jon
And learning to like, let go of the seasonal ones, whether it’s because your job or sometimes it has to, it is tough. But there’s something so freeing about it. It’s almost like you’re not drowning, right? Because once you realize, like, Hey, this is great, I would enjoy it.
09;24;29;16 – 09;24;15;15
Jon
But time will tell what type of friendship this is. There’s such a freedom in that because otherwise very clingy. And then especially when you see a life change coming down, you start to kind of like panic, like at is going to take you to the other side and then becomes this big emotional benefit.
09;24;15;15 – 09;24;03;02
Jon
Doesn’t know. But if you know it’s like, Well, this is wonderful, now we’ll see the other side. And if it doesn’t say, OK, that was such a gift for that time. That’s right, and I can continue forward in that, and it just freeze you to be more present.
09;24;03;02 – 09;23;44;22
Jon
Enjoy it in the moment. And the other thing that I’m just hearing scream out through this is there’s a. Through that, through the very core of it, right, and the distinction of like using the terms like giving versus taking the type of friendship and who shown up is that when you make this less, you’re going through it
09;23;44;16 – 09;23;42;09
Jon
. It’s not an excuse to abdicate responsibility.
09;23;40;23 – 09;23;36;07
Aaron
It’s Premiere that fight came from. Yeah, yeah. And I’m doing the dishes and he looks better.
09;23;36;01 – 09;23;35;28
Aaron
Yeah.
09;23;33;06 – 09;23;21;15
Jon
It’s actually a call to further press in and pick up in shoulder responsibilities. That’s right. I think that’s counterintuitive that when you hear like, oh, it’s like giving for me to do acts, it’s like taking me to do this.
09;23;21;15 – 09;23;08;14
Jon
This makes me happy. This doesn’t. Well, yeah. But if you bear into your responsibilities and you’re falling in with them, up with everything you have, then it changes that. Great. You know, there’s that distinction. I’m just smelling here.
09;23;08;00 – 09;23;07;22
Aaron
And.
09;23;07;12 – 09;22;53;09
Aaron
You have the ability to influence all those things you don’t like. So whether you’re not, you’re the one that’s physically there or you’re delegating it another way, how to do it, to make sure it gets done. So you don’t crash out continuing that practice.
09;22;52;04 – 09;22;33;20
Aaron
I just. So I’m wondering when I when I hear about life giving life taking, I know for me it’s different depending on how, how much energy I have. So if I’m fatigued, life sucking looks different. Like, say, like, I normally love talking on the phone when I’m tired.
09;22;33;09 – 09;22;22;09
Aaron
Hate it. Absolutely hate it, right? So how do you make the distinction when you’re doing that list? You know what is truly life taking versus this? Is me out of gas up not wanting to do this? Mm-Hmm.
09;22;21;14 – 09;22;20;06
Rick
Well, I don’t know. A first.
09;22;20;06 – 09;22;19;06
Aaron
Round, I would say.
09;22;19;06 – 09;22;17;21
Rick
Pretty pretty much comes easy.
09;22;17;21 – 09;22;16;08
Aaron
To us with life sucking.
09;22;16;07 – 09;22;14;20
Aaron
Yeah, I think people.
09;22;14;20 – 09;22;08;11
Aaron
Always start on that list. But then what’s life giving to me? I may or may not know. I need to see a list of things that helps me think about it.
09;22;07;19 – 09;22;06;10
Rick
Managing energy to me.
09;22;06;10 – 09;22;04;14
Aaron
Is something different because we.
09;22;04;14 – 09;21;58;08
Rick
Life’s hard and my energy is affected by the weather. Yeah, it’s not only.
09;21;58;08 – 09;21;56;09
Aaron
Affected by the weather, but it does have an effect.
09;21;55;11 – 09;21;50;07
Rick
And so, you know, when I think about a leader leaving for the long.
09;21;50;07 – 09;21;47;16
Aaron
Haul, it first starts with leading their heart, which.
09;21;47;16 – 09;21;46;15
Rick
To me is life giving.
09;21;46;15 – 09;21;45;07
Aaron
And life sucking. You are you.
09;21;44;19 – 09;21;43;03
Rick
Focused in and placing yourself.
09;21;43;03 – 09;21;42;29
Aaron
On.
09;21;42;29 – 09;21;39;22
Rick
Life giving limbs and then gardening.
09;21;39;22 – 09;21;36;21
Aaron
Or even separating yourself from what leading right.
09;21;35;25 – 09;21;34;19
Rick
Then leaving yourself.
09;21;34;19 – 09;21;20;07
Aaron
Kind of falls into the 5%? And it’s like, How am I the father? I want to be the husband, the friend. And do I have a spiritual warfare? Am I just pretending to?
09;21;19;11 – 09;21;18;14
Rick
And in my health.
09;21;18;14 – 09;21;11;07
Aaron
You know, some seasons I’m I’m exercising and doing great and then other seasons, it’s terrible. But it’s still me. It’s all me.
09;21;10;14 – 09;21;04;10
Rick
And it is attached to energy. So here’s why I combine the two the the life giving things that.
09;21;04;10 – 09;20;56;27
Aaron
Show up on your list. Some of those need to be showing up in that percent with those people in those areas.
09;20;56;13 – 09;20;55;04
Rick
And here’s what I find is.
09;20;55;04 – 09;20;52;21
Aaron
Compounding from an energy standpoint.
09;20;52;21 – 09;20;50;22
Rick
When I get to do multiple life giving.
09;20;50;21 – 09;20;46;18
Aaron
Things, I recover faster than when I don’t get to do, like doing things.
09;20;46;02 – 09;20;44;13
Rick
So if I had a hard day.
09;20;43;21 – 09;20;38;20
Aaron
At the office or whatever and then filled the pleases and also a ton of meetings.
09;20;37;28 – 09;20;37;02
Rick
But I really want.
09;20;37;02 – 09;20;36;00
Aaron
To engage my family.
09;20;35;20 – 09;20;34;11
Rick
Know we’d like to when it’s warm.
09;20;34;11 – 09;20;33;05
Aaron
We like to cook out and stuff.
09;20;33;05 – 09;20;29;28
Rick
So I know that if I get to throw the.
09;20;29;28 – 09;20;19;22
Aaron
Ball with the kids, if I get to come home first and have ten minutes for myself. Fire up the grill and we get to be outside in the war. I’m hitting some of those.
09;20;19;11 – 09;20;17;26
Rick
Life giving things and it’s.
09;20;17;26 – 09;20;13;06
Aaron
Compounding in my day wasn’t that bad. By the time the sun sets.
09;20;12;28 – 09;20;09;18
Rick
You know, but if I came home and I didn’t get any of those.
09;20;09;18 – 09;20;02;11
Aaron
Life doing things, and in fact, I came home to more problems, you know, so I started working. two kids are fighting.
09;20;00;29 – 09;19;57;14
Rick
Laura had a bad day. All it’s going to do is.
09;19;56;26 – 09;19;53;14
Aaron
Zap what little? And I go into survival.
09;19;52;22 – 09;19;40;18
Aaron
And it’s like, All right, I need to figure out, All right, maybe I need to go out for a drive. All right. And I’m trying to recover because I don’t want to abdicate my responsibilities. I don’t want to check out.
09;19;40;01 – 09;19;37;27
Rick
But I’m human and I want to learn.
09;19;37;27 – 09;19;37;03
Aaron
How to regulate.
09;19;37;03 – 09;19;34;26
Rick
So if I’m always running on empty.
09;19;34;26 – 09;19;27;26
Aaron
Or a slow charge of 20% throughout the week, I got nothing really for the most important things in my life. That’s what I’ve learned through my burnout.
09;19;27;08 – 09;19;24;18
Rick
But if I’m managing my life giving and.
09;19;24;18 – 09;19;23;12
Aaron
Actually makes room for.
09;19;23;10 – 09;19;22;15
Rick
That, I can handle the.
09;19;22;15 – 09;19;20;02
Aaron
Hardships and the mediocrity.
09;19;19;25 – 09;19;19;10
Aaron
That is.
09;19;19;08 – 09;19;12;24
Aaron
That’s what we were talking about this right now. They’re podcasts like this. I was just thinking to the master key and yes.
09;19;12;21 – 09;18;51;03
Jon
Episode two, it’s called Restaurant Nights, looking at the concept, and I started discussing right when Aaron showed up on. How changing like, how you can utilize change to recharge. And it’s essentially what you’re talking about if you start trying to work whatever your work is and you find it that a change of pace that recharges use, throwing
09;18;51;03 – 09;18;30;11
Jon
the ball and ruling and investing in your kids. Yeah, that change in that investment at that time, that whimsical play well could be something is precisely the type of change we’re talking about in restaurants. So it’s kind of fine because there there’s just this core principle there that we’re now having two very different conversations articulating the same
09;18;30;11 – 09;18;22;24
Jon
point for different energy and managers and viewpoint. So it’s really fun. If you like this aspect of conversation, check out Episode ten Shameless Plug.
09;18;21;22 – 09;18;21;22
Aaron
Yeah.
09;18;20;04 – 09;18;16;28
Aaron
It reminds me of a book called The Power of Full Engagement.
09;18;16;11 – 09;18;15;01
Rick
Managing energy not.
09;18;15;01 – 09;18;12;13
Aaron
Time is the key to high performance and personal real.
09;18;11;26 – 09;18;09;24
Rick
Interesting, and this is a study.
09;18;09;24 – 09;18;06;26
Aaron
Of athletes and professionals and.
09;18;05;04 – 09;18;03;02
Rick
The reality is, is that energy.
09;18;02;26 – 09;18;00;28
Aaron
Is huge for us. This is you guys are.
09;18;00;28 – 09;17;58;12
Rick
Describing it and there’s a great.
09;17;58;12 – 09;17;55;01
Aaron
Chapter in there on recovery, intentional recovery.
09;17;54;28 – 09;17;54;20
Rick
You know.
09;17;54;20 – 09;17;49;15
Aaron
Athletes have to intentionally recover their body nutrition, those kind of things.
09;17;48;24 – 09;17;46;29
Rick
And scientific study.
09;17;46;28 – 09;17;45;18
Aaron
On how.
09;17;45;10 – 09;17;43;22
Rick
We grow the deepest.
09;17;43;21 – 09;17;42;03
Aaron
When we recover the best.
09;17;41;18 – 09;17;41;12
Aaron
Mm hmm.
09;17;40;29 – 09;17;39;13
Rick
So there’s some kind of aspect.
09;17;39;13 – 09;17;35;17
Aaron
Of strength that happens in the US where we set aside time to recover.
09;17;35;07 – 09;17;25;24
Rick
I think that’s a wisdom out of God and in a Sabbath in which you see in the Bible. But I also see in the reality of when I have the freedom.
09;17;25;24 – 09;17;24;24
Aaron
To replenish.
09;17;24;23 – 09;17;24;17
Rick
And.
09;17;24;17 – 09;17;23;08
Aaron
Choose to replenish.
09;17;22;27 – 09;17;19;25
Rick
I am better. For everything that.
09;17;19;24 – 09;17;19;05
Aaron
Matters most.
09;17;18;13 – 09;17;16;26
Rick
To me when I push.
09;17;16;26 – 09;17;13;18
Aaron
Through like car, it’s going to be a busy few weeks and will work on my days off.
09;17;13;00 – 09;17;07;08
Rick
I’m hanging on by a thread running on energy and I’m not better than hitting.
09;17;07;08 – 09;17;05;28
Aaron
Me of some side.
09;17;05;17 – 09;17;02;23
Rick
Curve ball comes in. But I didn’t expect, and it.
09;17;02;23 – 09;17;01;24
Aaron
Just knocks me off.
09;17;01;01 – 09;16;49;25
Jon
So you say, Gee, thanks to that wonderful. The first one is the distinction of when you have the ability to rest, right? Yes, there are going to be times that her guess what?
09;16;49;15 – 09;16;48;19
Aaron
Buckle up, boys.
09;16;47;21 – 09;16;30;15
Jon
And there is no such thing as the opportunity to rest. No, that’s fine. And in being intentional and aware enough to really look at the circumstances and say, is this that situation is important because it’s easy to, at least in my experience, very easy to say in that situation.
09;16;30;13 – 09;16;18;23
Jon
Yeah, right? But once you’re identified, no, this is in fact a situation where it’s time to abolish it. Just keep going. Then you do what you have to do. That’s right. But what you’re talking about is beyond really challenging.
09;16;18;23 – 09;16;01;08
Jon
Is this what I need to do? And if the answer is no right, this isn’t a situation in which you need to buckle in. You’re choosing this. Then that’s where if you really want to have impact, if you really want to lead well, if you really want to just drive and experience victory here, you’d better learn quickly
09;16;01;00 – 09;15;57;26
Jon
that that hole just go to take things not going to you there.
09;15;57;23 – 09;15;55;07
Rick
It’s not. And I’m not throwing a ton of books at you.
09;15;55;04 – 09;15;50;20
Aaron
Another one that addresses that totally essentialism by Greg McCallum.
09;15;50;04 – 09;15;49;03
Rick
And it’s the disciplined.
09;15;49;03 – 09;15;47;18
Aaron
Pursuit of doing less.
09;15;46;13 – 09;15;45;00
Rick
And he has some.
09;15;45;00 – 09;15;41;02
Aaron
Great thoughts in there about getting comfortable with disappointing others.
09;15;39;27 – 09;15;38;04
Aaron
Wow. Well, because.
09;15;37;13 – 09;15;35;23
Aaron
John’s got a big student smile on his face.
09;15;34;26 – 09;15;31;17
Aaron
As much as he does, he loves this.
09;15;31;17 – 09;15;29;20
Aaron
Guy. You got it. I know it’s a good place.
09;15;29;20 – 09;15;16;26
Jon
To be fair. I aspire to get more comfortable on that because I heard you made a comment earlier about your naturally peacekeeper. I 100% relate to that, and I’m not sure if those around you can see that. I don’t know.
09;15;16;14 – 09;14;57;11
Jon
I imagine as close to me, I can see how that plays out, but I prefer to bridge the peace, especially in unison against a singular enemy, right? Like, if you are on the other line, you’re my fellow. That’s a very different conversation from I’m talking about, right, right here on the perceive my side.
09;14;56;24 – 09;14;38;06
Jon
We’re on the same side, whatever that looks like. Then I want to be that peacekeeper until, you know, a line is crossed. But I love it because one of the things that I’m personally challenging myself in that I’m a better defining, frankly, from this conversation and I’ve been doing it through a lot of our conversations kind of
09;14;38;06 – 09;14;18;12
Jon
intuitively know like I want to with absolute comfort, you know, disappoint people because it’s the right thing to do for the people. I’m responsible to the organizations, they’re responsible to myself, to my faith, to whatever. And frankly, it’s probably the right thing for them to do, as you know, whatever that may be, if you’re not growing that
09;14;18;12 – 09;14;18;04
Jon
right?
09;14;17;28 – 09;14;16;19
Rick
Yeah. And I think it to.
09;14;16;19 – 09;14;14;26
Aaron
Me, it needs to be anchored to values.
09;14;14;16 – 09;14;13;20
Rick
And I think that’s.
09;14;13;20 – 09;14;10;01
Aaron
Really where the rubber meets the road in.
09;14;10;01 – 09;14;03;29
Rick
Life because we can’t do everything. You know, if if we only have certain amount of money.
09;14;03;29 – 09;14;03;04
Aaron
To send our kids to.
09;14;03;04 – 09;14;01;04
Rick
Camp and it’s a.
09;14;01;04 – 09;13;55;05
Aaron
It’s a winter retreat that’s more spiritual in nature or to go to a basketball camp.
09;13;54;06 – 09;13;53;13
Rick
And we have to pick.
09;13;53;13 – 09;13;46;09
Aaron
Between those who are more likely going to do the winter retreat because I believe developing their souls to better prepare them for life, I don’t think they’re going to be.
09;13;45;15 – 09;13;44;13
Aaron
There’s an easier decision.
09;13;43;16 – 09;13;41;24
Rick
It is because it’s about you, even though.
09;13;41;24 – 09;13;41;21
Aaron
It’s.
09;13;41;21 – 09;13;40;01
Aaron
Disappointing and they want to do both.
09;13;39;16 – 09;13;36;07
Rick
So it isn’t just I love with disappointing people.
09;13;36;07 – 09;13;33;18
Aaron
In fact, I really don’t. It’s hard on me emotionally.
09;13;32;28 – 09;13;30;19
Rick
But if I made my decision anchored to values and at.
09;13;30;19 – 09;13;23;25
Aaron
Least I know why, I’m disappointed someone and then I’m still holding to that value and that helps me a little more integrity.
09;13;23;12 – 09;13;11;05
Jon
And to be clear, that’s what I’m describing. Yeah, that’s that’s what I’m saying. I want to grow and not their disappointment. In spite, I know that intentional it’s value basis for a reason. That’s right. But just like the added.
09;13;09;21 – 09;13;02;22
Jon
The ability to be comfortable because I’m doing it right now, you are right being more comfortable and if.
09;13;02;14 – 09;12;47;09
Aaron
You will, and you got to start by disappointing yourself. Yeah, because there’s certain situations, there’s certain things that you have have that you want to do, but you’ve told yourself ahead of time. Hey, I’ve committed to this, this is a value of mine and this is competing with that value.
09;12;47;00 – 09;12;32;09
Aaron
And so you say no to yourself all the time. And so when somebody else comes along that wants to do something that’s outside of your kind of your your mason jar or whatever. I don’t have the room for that because my values is all I have, right?
09;12;32;04 – 09;12;28;17
Aaron
And that’s all. I’m not adding more to my value.
09;12;28;14 – 09;12;26;00
Rick
Yeah, once you get comfortable with that, then you.
09;12;26;00 – 09;12;24;08
Aaron
Have to get comfortable with the resistance.
09;12;24;03 – 09;12;23;15
Rick
That comes.
09;12;23;15 – 09;12;12;15
Aaron
From you living out of values because people will be disappointed or frustrated opportunities that you may have wanted to lose because you’re choosing your value over that opportunity.
09;12;10;29 – 09;12;08;20
Rick
Jobs that want you to do more.
09;12;08;20 – 09;12;05;11
Aaron
Than you’re willing to want you on their team.
09;12;04;12 – 09;12;01;12
Rick
So it’s not like it’s all roses, you know? Hey.
09;12;00;20 – 09;11;58;17
Aaron
What does butterflies and rainbows where you’re like.
09;11;58;03 – 09;11;56;23
Rick
I know my values now and I.
09;11;56;23 – 09;11;54;00
Aaron
Live out of principle and then everything is fine.
09;11;53;29 – 09;11;47;16
Rick
That’s why I think it’s really good on the inside. But you know, we we live in a.
09;11;47;15 – 09;11;43;26
Aaron
World I think that gravitates towards on health and not health, right?
09;11;43;23 – 09;11;41;25
Rick
So you’re basically taking.
09;11;41;25 – 09;11;38;04
Aaron
Away from those things that are unhealthy and going to experience resistance.
09;11;37;11 – 09;11;29;07
Aaron
So every day on your devices? Yeah, right. Hey, check this out. Look at this. Read this article! Go to this link and sign up for this thing that to control your life like now.
09;11;28;28 – 09;11;08;24
Jon
And that’s just like that low and static noise distraction, right? Because what you’re talking about is define your values that are such that you’re willing to say no to other things, right? It’s right. I feel like so many people, myself included, not not as much now, but I can remember when saying no to something like you’re you’re
09;11;08;24 – 09;10;54;27
Jon
making a judgment call. Like, now that’s not going to be, you know, hard to pass. And it takes a confidence and that is a skill, a muscle to be grown in current ones that we’re talking about a lot.
09;10;54;25 – 09;10;44;22
Jon
It’s OK, especially for leaders like if you’re going to be leading anything, start really doing yourself, which we’ve already talked about, but you don’t have to know how to say no to things and how to disappoint one dose.
09;10;44;18 – 09;10;25;27
Jon
You’re leading, right? Just say no because it’s off target or the wrong objective or different things. So the more you know. There, but it’s also interesting, and I think that from what we’ve talked about with the arch rival India right now, Canada’s mission is worth it.
09;10;25;20 – 09;10;10;25
Jon
It’s easier to learn to say no in a leadership capacity or professional capacity because it’s the job, right? It’s more difficult when you bring it closer and closer and closer to your heart to home. Right now, I’m saying no to my friends.
09;10;10;24 – 09;09;58;18
Jon
Now I’m saying or now I’m saying no to friends, period. But as a friend, right? That’s going to hurt. That’s right. That’s going to redefine you individual in me. Now I’m saying no to an entire way of life.
09;09;56;24 – 09;09;40;25
Jon
Like, when I left the military, it was because I realized that by the choice I made, I could not be the person I believe I was meant to be. That was a very personal thing. There’s many, many, many people who bought jobs and becoming the best version selves and serving beautifully.
09;09;39;16 – 09;09;26;18
Jon
I realized just on some very personal aspects that I wanted to change. So I had to say no to my entire identity and an entire way of life as an adult and professional. You know, that’s the type of know I’m talking about.
09;09;26;13 – 09;09;19;02
Jon
That becomes painful. But once you learn to make those names. Man, the other things are easier. Yeah.
09;09;18;23 – 09;09;07;18
Aaron
You’re right on in, so if you invert that and say, OK, I’m living out a life giving you my heart and then leaving my son, leaving myself as best as I can, and these are and then it goes out to our.
09;09;07;06 – 09;09;05;10
Rick
Mission business.
09;09;05;10 – 09;09;04;10
Aaron
Calling whatever.
09;09;02;18 – 09;09;00;15
Rick
Then it trickles down into how the how.
09;09;00;15 – 09;08;59;24
Aaron
You do your work.
09;08;58;28 – 09;08;58;19
Rick
You know.
09;08;58;18 – 09;08;55;28
Aaron
What are you living in your ideal workweek? Are you.
09;08;55;21 – 09;08;54;14
Rick
Having your hand in the things that.
09;08;54;14 – 09;08;49;17
Aaron
Only you need to have your hands to? It goes to a responsibility of, you.
09;08;49;17 – 09;08;49;01
Rick
Know, what comes.
09;08;49;01 – 09;08;41;27
Aaron
On my plate weekly every other week, monthly, quarterly, yearly that I need to pay attention to, or I need to help our team for attention to.
09;08;41;08 – 09;08;39;24
Rick
Because we’re all anchored to.
09;08;39;24 – 09;08;39;00
Aaron
Values.
09;08;38;29 – 09;08;36;14
Rick
You know, you start with yourself, otherwise you don’t.
09;08;36;14 – 09;08;32;26
Aaron
Have a true north and directionless and just the world eats you up.
09;08;32;15 – 09;08;29;24
Rick
When you have any. But when you feel like.
09;08;29;24 – 09;08;29;05
Aaron
You, you.
09;08;29;05 – 09;08;27;21
Rick
Are there, locked in.
09;08;27;21 – 09;08;23;16
Aaron
And you’re seeing your own self and you’re obviously we’re always growing and becoming more aware.
09;08;22;27 – 09;08;22;02
Rick
But then that spills.
09;08;22;02 – 09;08;19;15
Aaron
Over into the intentional way that you and your business.
09;08;19;06 – 09;08;17;29
Rick
And you can read.
09;08;17;15 – 09;08;17;01
Aaron
Stat.
09;08;17;01 – 09;08;05;24
Aaron
After stat about how many people hate where they work and the reasons why they hate, where they work and how they’ve had a great boss or how they have not so great boss. And you get to infuse culture because.
09;08;05;10 – 09;08;03;26
Rick
The way you’re doing businesses.
09;08;03;23 – 09;08;02;00
Aaron
Is anchored to some values as well.
09;08;01;24 – 09;07;56;17
Rick
But as practice with the individual first. A lot of times we want to invert.
09;07;56;17 – 09;07;51;04
Aaron
Those and make nice vision statements and value statements and whether.
09;07;51;03 – 09;07;49;12
Rick
They’re inauthentic and the.
09;07;49;12 – 09;07;34;13
Aaron
People who are leading those organizations are inauthentic as well because it’s not really shown in their personal lives. Yeah. And so when you are consistent with those places, it speaks volume. Our culture craves vulnerability and authenticity.
09;07;34;02 – 09;07;33;06
Rick
Not for the sake of.
09;07;32;16 – 09;07;22;07
Aaron
Being whiny and victim, but just for the sake of this is what’s really going on in our life. And this is where I’m growing, and this is how this is the kind of environment we want to grow and build in our business.
09;07;21;26 – 09;07;06;16
Jon
But there’s a big difference between being vulnerable and authentic and being a bit more whiny. Yeah, right. That there’s a distinction, right? There’s been a number of times, some examples, even in this conversation, just owning their own ability being shot.
09;07;06;12 – 09;06;50;28
Jon
Right. But there is no lack of ownership in it. So that does it, really. I think there’s a good distinction there. Anything you keep talking, you know, the lack of giving in, you know, your ideal workweek that kind of brought it to head in my mind is a let’s call this out.
09;06;50;15 – 09;06;43;27
Jon
The ideal work week. I’m not hearing you say it means comfortable workweek. It’s ideal. Not comfortable.
09;06;43;22 – 09;06;43;00
Rick
It’s intentional.
09;06;43;00 – 09;06;30;13
Jon
It’s intentional. You know what makes something ideal? Because the first thing I thought of is like, some person is like, Oh, I’m not working. I’m I’m doing more than 40 hours flat. I have to go deal with people.
09;06;30;08 – 09;06;19;24
Jon
You know, it’s just like all these whiny discomfort things that are just like foolish excuses. And I just don’t want to give them that coupon right now to describe what we’re talking about, because I think it’s more valuable.
09;06;19;07 – 09;06;17;21
Jon
So let’s take that coupon away, can you?
09;06;17;00 – 09;06;15;12
Aaron
Yeah. I think if.
09;06;15;12 – 09;06;12;21
Aaron
Ideal work, we can do.
09;06;12;14 – 09;06;11;01
Rick
A few things and remember, I’m not.
09;06;10;24 – 09;06;07;29
Aaron
Separating personal and professional and combining the two.
09;06;07;24 – 09;06;03;14
Rick
So we would start with life giving what’s happening this week?
09;06;03;07 – 09;06;02;00
Aaron
That’s life giving for me.
09;06;00;28 – 09;05;59;28
Rick
So I’ve been talking.
09;05;59;17 – 09;05;57;02
Aaron
With a spiritual mentor once a month.
09;05;56;29 – 09;05;56;05
Rick
And we were.
09;05;56;05 – 09;05;51;17
Aaron
Talking about this because I’m having a epiphany about the difference between an employee and an entrepreneur.
09;05;50;20 – 09;05;48;26
Rick
And how I’ve mostly.
09;05;48;26 – 09;05;41;20
Aaron
Been an employee all my life and now trying to do the business and build a business through a ministry and build a ministry.
09;05;40;25 – 09;05;36;13
Rick
But in the end, all of this what’s life giving to me.
09;05;36;13 – 09;05;35;26
Aaron
Throughout this.
09;05;35;26 – 09;05;33;12
Rick
Week and we talked about.
09;05;33;12 – 09;05;30;17
Aaron
The concept of rest stops, which I’m going to try.
09;05;30;03 – 09;05;28;24
Rick
When I was a kid, or.
09;05;28;23 – 09;05;26;25
Aaron
You look for the next rest stop on a road trip.
09;05;26;16 – 09;05;24;15
Rick
You know one’s coming up, you’re going to get.
09;05;24;15 – 09;05;20;23
Aaron
Snacks, you use the restroom, run around in the grass.
09;05;20;12 – 09;05;14;14
Aaron
Stretch your legs, needle pile, power the vehicle to the next one. That alone makes them more bearable. Exactly.
09;05;13;27 – 09;05;09;12
Rick
So we’re talking about maybe a 30 minute rest stop. Plan that one.
09;05;09;12 – 09;05;07;12
Aaron
Time this week, it’s for you.
09;05;06;20 – 09;05;05;12
Rick
And then maybe it can.
09;05;05;12 – 09;05;00;23
Aaron
Grow, so if it’s really nice out, we can mountain bike or just go for a walk or whatever.
09;05;00;23 – 09;04;55;04
Rick
But whatever out of that life giving line, there’s a room for it. Then think of the 5% my.
09;04;55;03 – 09;04;52;10
Aaron
Honoring, my 5% in my ideal workweek.
09;04;51;20 – 09;04;48;14
Rick
So Laura and I have Friday morning breakfast together.
09;04;48;14 – 09;04;40;04
Aaron
That’s one of our constants. My kids are older now, so I have to plan special dates with them versus I’m going to see them right when I come home from work.
09;04;38;20 – 09;04;38;05
Rick
And my meeting.
09;04;38;04 – 09;04;28;19
Aaron
With a friend this week or next week. So you get the idea and then into the professional line, it’s like, how do I work for this? Do I get the freedom to design some of that.
09;04;27;14 – 09;04;25;01
Rick
And meetings that I’m a.
09;04;25;01 – 09;04;20;16
Aaron
Part of direct reports, frequency of direct towards responsibilities.
09;04;20;16 – 09;04;20;13
Rick
I.
09;04;20;13 – 09;04;17;29
Aaron
Can’t seem to get to, but they really are responsibilities.
09;04;16;25 – 09;04;15;14
Rick
Sometimes just lining.
09;04;15;14 – 09;04;10;24
Aaron
Out those most important, you gain ten to 30% a margin in your week just.
09;04;10;24 – 09;04;09;19
Rick
By doing it differently.
09;04;09;19 – 09;04;06;16
Aaron
Than what you were doing at work for a time that no longer works.
09;04;06;16 – 09;04;03;05
Rick
Now. And that’s OK. It’s not like shame. It’s just like, Hey, you got.
09;04;03;05 – 09;03;59;17
Aaron
Me here, but it’s not working. We need to evolve and scale it to something different.
09;03;58;27 – 09;03;56;14
Rick
And then you that heels into like.
09;03;56;14 – 09;03;54;27
Aaron
Your leadership teams. You know.
09;03;54;22 – 09;03;52;27
Rick
When when do we have a team meeting?
09;03;52;27 – 09;03;44;23
Aaron
Do we ever have a strategy planning retreat? Why or why not? What are times to evaluate what our times, the vision and where we’re headed to course? Correct.
09;03;44;01 – 09;03;40;05
Rick
Every place is different, yet the same because it involves.
09;03;40;05 – 09;03;33;21
Aaron
People and there’s a rhythm to our work and frequency. So ideal work week isn’t the retirement workweek for our.
09;03;33;11 – 09;03;32;10
Rick
Monday Tuesday at the.
09;03;32;10 – 09;03;29;01
Aaron
Beach. There’s Wednesday on golfing or whatever that would.
09;03;28;29 – 09;03;28;03
Rick
That would be awesome.
09;03;28;03 – 09;03;27;11
Aaron
To squeeze some.
09;03;27;11 – 09;03;23;28
Rick
Things in there. But but hopefully as you’re learning.
09;03;23;28 – 09;03;18;23
Aaron
More about yourself, you’re starting to choose things and you kind of alluded to this that.
09;03;18;09 – 09;03;17;17
Rick
I’m doing work.
09;03;17;17 – 09;03;11;28
Aaron
That matters most to me. And this wasn’t the thing that making my heart sing, so to speak or let you north.
09;03;11;02 – 09;03;10;10
Rick
And as you get.
09;03;10;10 – 09;02;58;25
Aaron
More self aware, I found that you start to get clear on that divine design and the things that kind of maybe you were designed to do. And hopefully we start finding those pathways in that kind of works in your effort.
09;02;58;00 – 09;02;51;02
Aaron
Well, I was I was thinking about when I was first married and we did the whole system for money.
09;02;50;26 – 09;02;50;14
Aaron
Yeah.
09;02;49;14 – 09;02;48;10
Jon
Shout out to Dave Ramsey.
09;02;48;10 – 09;02;27;09
Aaron
You remember those days like, know other entertainment budgets like I was like 20 bucks or something. I think you bought last Lester. You know, it’s like, What is it? That’s what we had. But when we spent that money, it was there was no anxiety at all because we just we knew exactly how much we had and how
09;02;25;11 – 09;02;12;12
Aaron
. It’s like, All right, I guess we’re doing something free. You know, when you’re a CEO or your wife, it’s kind of we’re talking about we’re not being employees of our life, being kind of tossed to and fro by everybody who asks the question.
09;02;12;12 – 09;01;54;03
Aaron
We say, yes, we’re the world’s employee. No, versus the CEO is like, OK, Ivan, I’ve been made this way. I have a specific web design, and in some way, I think is things that give me life, as you say, things that take life away from me and I know those things and I’m in a lot my life
09;01;54;03 – 09;01;50;11
Aaron
intentionally. I set myself up for success as.
09;01;50;11 – 09;01;49;12
Rick
Much as you can throw.
09;01;49;12 – 09;01;36;22
Aaron
Yourself softball, just loves me all knock this out of the park every time. If I get my ass, put myself in this situation because this is how I made. But I have to, but I have to schedule it right to make it.
09;01;36;22 – 09;01;35;26
Aaron
You have to protect it.
09;01;35;14 – 09;01;32;22
Rick
Yeah, because there are things you are ironically, an.
09;01;32;22 – 09;01;31;01
Aaron
Employee and an entrepreneur.
09;01;30;23 – 09;01;30;15
Aaron
Right?
09;01;30;05 – 09;01;26;06
Rick
But and there are things that have to be done, which I don’t.
09;01;26;06 – 09;01;25;09
Aaron
Like, right?
09;01;25;00 – 09;01;23;00
Rick
And I can choose to ignore those. And then it would be.
09;01;23;00 – 09;01;21;02
Aaron
Catastrophic for the organization.
09;01;21;01 – 09;01;20;00
Aaron
However, I.
09;01;20;00 – 09;01;16;08
Rick
Can also say, well, right now, I need to spend extra time to.
09;01;16;08 – 09;01;12;22
Aaron
Make sure it gets done, but this is going to be the first thing I will hire when I can, hardly.
09;01;12;13 – 09;01;12;09
Jon
So.
09;01;12;06 – 09;01;11;09
Aaron
For someone who loves them.
09;01;11;09 – 09;00;54;09
Jon
Yet I love what you talk about right now is there that you see it a lot when someone who’s a technician really good at it. Skill? Right? Yeah, starts a business. So what I’m thinking here is that let’s say young, a carpenter who starts a business right there that carpentry they love working with their hands, that wood
09;00;54;09 – 09;00;42;15
Jon
or a baker is another one. You see a lot of our plumber. You see these guys. You like, these people do this a lot. They start the business and then they realize, Wait, I’m not just making pies. I have to be a business owner.
09;00;42;15 – 09;00;30;13
Jon
That’s that’s a job for this profession. There’s about 80 things that are involved with that. So it’s not just one thing you’re not making, you’re not making anymore. That’s like one little aspect of everything you have to do to thrive.
09;00;30;03 – 09;00;19;22
Jon
And that’s where like when you said, you have to say, I’ll do this for now, it’s part of my job. I’m owned by this in the business I’ve created, which I know that for the from the onslaught, for the most part, right?
09;00;19;21 – 09;00;12;28
Jon
Most people aren’t aware. And just like I have to go now, I have to balance finance, but and to do the logistics for supplies. And that’s the only.
09;00;12;28 – 09;00;12;21
Aaron
Thing.
09;00;12;12 – 10;59;55;07
Aaron
That I think the humbling and that we have to do is hire managers for ourself is kind of doing less less like employees, more like, Hey, this is a value I have in my organization and say, I need you to look at this light on the dashboard and tell me what I need to do in relation to
10;59;55;07 – 10;59;51;17
Aaron
that and help me work through that versus just owning everything.
10;59;51;14 – 10;59;35;06
Jon
Or even one step before that. Like what if I can’t hiring, you know, right? So it’s just awareness. Yeah, yeah. Mentors are typically this sounds funny, but mentors are typically free monetarily. You have to be willing to be humble enough to seek it.
10;59;34;26 – 10;59;17;19
Jon
You have to be humble. That’s right. You need it, and you have to be willing to invest energy to seek it out. That’s right. And that makes it incredibly expensive. Right. Right. In a different type of sense. But when you look at it’s just funny, because one of the first things that I think about going into business
10;59;17;19 – 10;59;06;10
Jon
around talking to someone who wants to do business thing is like, OK, that sounds awesome. How are you going to engage with this, this, this and this? And then you just kind of sometimes you see the wind kind of leave their shell.
10;59;06;10 – 10;58;55;01
Jon
So, hey, I’m not trying to hurt you. I want to encourage you here. Let’s talk about this list of factors. You go put a plan together and then or you just blow me off right now and we don’t talk about this ever again.
10;58;55;01 – 10;58;42;05
Jon
That’s fine. But but think about this because if you want to really thrive in the gift of doing whatever thing you’re talking about, if you have a plan going into an awareness that these are requirements, you’re going to have so much more fun until you can outsource that.
10;58;41;21 – 10;58;39;10
Rick
Yeah, yeah. Awareness is like, OK.
10;58;39;09 – 10;58;37;21
Aaron
This is what has to be covered.
10;58;37;19 – 10;58;37;09
Aaron
Yeah.
10;58;37;06 – 10;58;36;06
Rick
And then the reality.
10;58;36;06 – 10;58;34;20
Aaron
Is on the what happened to come? Yeah.
10;58;33;15 – 10;58;32;01
Aaron
Yeah. And then it’s like, is this.
10;58;32;01 – 10;58;30;15
Rick
Show up in my work.
10;58;30;15 – 10;58;29;07
Aaron
Week at all on the.
10;58;29;07 – 10;58;24;02
Rick
Month because, you know, you know, like invoicing, but you like getting paid invoices have to be.
10;58;23;18 – 10;58;22;02
Aaron
You know, should be appointment.
10;58;22;02 – 10;58;21;27
Rick
On.
10;58;21;27 – 10;58;20;26
Aaron
Their send invoices.
10;58;20;26 – 10;58;20;10
Aaron
Out right.
10;58;20;08 – 10;58;18;18
Rick
Until you build something else.
10;58;18;18 – 10;58;16;27
Aaron
Systematically or automatic.
10;58;16;14 – 10;58;10;09
Aaron
They are working to that end at some point. I want to hire that, you know, so I’m not going to be that job forever.
10;58;09;29 – 10;58;04;26
Rick
Yeah. And the book email, the author talks about drawing a.
10;58;04;25 – 10;57;59;16
Aaron
Org chart of your business, regardless of if we have a ton of employees.
10;57;59;04 – 10;57;54;11
Rick
Is like, what’s the ideal structure of your business? And then now write your name and everyone.
10;57;53;22 – 10;57;53;13
Aaron
Yeah.
10;57;52;18 – 10;57;50;26
Rick
And then you pick, which was most.
10;57;50;26 – 10;57;48;15
Aaron
Important to develop and hand handoff to the next person.
10;57;48;15 – 10;57;45;15
Aaron
Yet you still have to do it. All right, so you can.
10;57;45;14 – 10;57;44;20
Aaron
Buy other things.
10;57;43;29 – 10;57;42;17
Jon
I love that so much.
10;57;42;02 – 10;57;41;07
Aaron
No, I wouldn’t.
10;57;40;11 – 10;57;26;08
Aaron
There’s one piece I don’t want on this because you got to be really think about that, like writing down a list and really being honest with yourself about what is life giving, what’s life taking in your life, and of course, coupling that with who you are.
10;57;24;17 – 10;57;04;02
Aaron
And, you know, back to that kind of energy piece. And some of us might just need like, Hey, find out, first, make the energy list. If you’re tired. Yeah, and like what things have historically had to be creative, it has in the past given the energy to try to go do that thing and come back and make
10;57;04;02 – 10;57;01;09
Aaron
the list, maybe. You know, we our brain is back.
10;57;00;22 – 10;56;58;29
Aaron
And I had that. If you’re depleted.
10;56;58;29 – 10;56;42;01
Aaron
When you’re depleted. I just I’ve had a few pivotal places in my life where if I went and arrested, the creativity comes back, the excitement, the dreams come back and going, This is easy right now. I want to do this.
10;56;42;01 – 10;56;40;25
Aaron
This this, let’s go for it.
10;56;40;13 – 10;56;26;20
Jon
Yeah. So who do you think is the richest person I think is really fun is the one. Why not do both right now by not doing, you know, your Super Bowl charge, right? Right. You’re broken this June by giving us something.
10;56;26;10 – 10;56;13;25
Jon
And then when you realize like, Wow, I am depleted right now, don’t look at the list, you may just grab a piece of paper. Scroll down when you think it is. Again, because I’d be curious to see what, if, what, if anything changes, right?
10;56;13;02 – 10;56;04;27
Jon
There’s something very homey. You may have lied to yourself that this is life giving, and then you realize when you’re depleted and you’re wrong about it that, oh yeah, this is not true.
10;56;04;25 – 10;56;02;29
Aaron
It’s just that is a point.
10;56;02;26 – 10;55;57;00
Rick
I think two things. one is if you’re depleted right now, then that just sounds like one more thing you have.
10;55;57;00 – 10;55;53;19
Aaron
To do for me would be look three.
10;55;53;19 – 10;55;52;28
Aaron
To four weeks.
10;55;52;28 – 10;55;50;22
Rick
Out in your calendar and find a two.
10;55;50;22 – 10;55;49;29
Aaron
Hour slot.
10;55;49;24 – 10;55;48;23
Rick
That you actually leave the.
10;55;48;23 – 10;55;46;15
Aaron
Office, go to a coffee shop or something.
10;55;46;00 – 10;55;45;04
Rick
And then give yourself.
10;55;45;04 – 10;55;42;29
Aaron
Space to write that list there.
10;55;41;29 – 10;55;40;19
Rick
But then secondarily.
10;55;40;19 – 10;55;39;00
Aaron
I think sometimes we.
10;55;38;13 – 10;55;36;23
Rick
Either have an operating.
10;55;36;23 – 10;55;30;11
Aaron
System that is ingrained things that are like giving to us or we aspirationally.
10;55;30;11 – 10;55;29;22
Rick
Want it to be.
10;55;29;22 – 10;55;27;29
Aaron
Life giving. There truly isn’t much.
10;55;27;21 – 10;55;22;29
Rick
But you’ll find over time that list will get clearer and more.
10;55;22;28 – 10;55;22;08
Aaron
Authentic.
10;55;21;26 – 10;55;20;16
Rick
So to me, it’s OK to have.
10;55;20;16 – 10;55;19;04
Aaron
It trickle down with some weeds.
10;55;18;23 – 10;55;18;08
Aaron
You know.
10;55;17;18 – 10;55;15;11
Aaron
This isn’t really life giving, but I want to be a.
10;55;15;11 – 10;55;14;18
Aaron
Runner or whatever.
10;55;12;28 – 10;55;09;01
Rick
But you know, over time, if you feel like.
10;55;09;01 – 10;55;03;26
Aaron
You have to do it or ought to do it, I think that’s a good discipline.
10;55;03;12 – 10;55;02;05
Rick
That may or may not be.
10;55;02;05 – 10;55;01;01
Aaron
Truly life giving.
10;55;00;14 – 10;54;59;03
Rick
one might be life giving.
10;54;59;03 – 10;54;57;26
Aaron
Is something that.
10;54;57;12 – 10;54;54;18
Rick
If you think about how you were in college.
10;54;53;25 – 10;54;45;16
Aaron
Or in your early twenties or you think about how you are on vacation and what I mean by truly shutting down, how do you recover?
10;54;45;10 – 10;54;44;08
Rick
Some of those things.
10;54;44;08 – 10;54;41;18
Aaron
To me have been triggers of what’s really like giving.
10;54;40;10 – 10;54;31;24
Aaron
When responsibilities left it? And how do you what is you acting like yourself, right? Yeah, when you’re really honest and say, Yeah.
10;54;31;02 – 10;54;19;19
Jon
So I think the big takeaway from the last five minutes of conversation is it’s not a finite list. Get it down and then keep testing and hold it up to the light and see what is what’s actually happening here.
10;54;19;19 – 10;54;05;06
Jon
And you’re going to see come weeks like, OK, I’m aspiring to have this be life giving for this, and I kind of saw this third category come out too, which I think is almost worth doing it, maybe as a as a refining of the list, not the initial list over time.
10;54;04;29 – 10;53;49;10
Jon
It’s like looking at what I believe to like, what it believed to be like taking and now I have the. Discipline category, where it’s not life giving, but I still to do it, whether I feel I’m supposed to or I know it’s beneficial to me and I think I need to.
10;53;49;02 – 10;53;34;25
Jon
Whatever it be. And then as you’re kind of cycling through, you can make out and I’m not a very athletic person, right? I don’t care about fitness, but I need to do to be healthy. I’m moving this from the waist down because that’s not true to the discipline initiative.
10;53;34;21 – 10;53;29;01
Jon
Yeah, you know, it’s nice talking. It’s a necessity. It’s at this point. I’ve heard things.
10;53;28;18 – 10;53;25;20
Aaron
Sometimes our disciplines help create life in us.
10;53;24;25 – 10;53;24;07
Rick
But we may not.
10;53;24;07 – 10;53;22;16
Aaron
Be motivated to do them right away.
10;53;22;12 – 10;53;20;04
Jon
The fruit of it’s the discipline to action that it’s not.
10;53;19;20 – 10;53;18;27
Rick
There’s wisdom.
10;53;18;27 – 10;53;04;19
Aaron
Interesting. So now, OK, say you make it instinctual when you say life giving. I think I go right way to like visceral like this makes me feel a certain way. But there’s also a piece where it’s actually life giving, even though I don’t like it.
10;53;04;14 – 10;53;03;21
Aaron
Mm hmm. Yeah.
10;53;02;22 – 10;53;01;25
Rick
Yeah. Because you know what’s.
10;53;01;25 – 10;52;59;13
Aaron
Good for you? So there’s a return on that, right?
10;52;59;12 – 10;52;50;25
Rick
But I would say that’s just as John said, it’s it’s third, because if you start there, then you’ll be still running on low.
10;52;50;16 – 10;52;49;26
Aaron
Mm-Hmm. Yeah.
10;52;49;20 – 10;52;47;16
Rick
Because it takes energy to engage.
10;52;47;16 – 10;52;44;07
Aaron
Things that along doing that, always think they’re good. We know they’re good for us.
10;52;43;11 – 10;52;26;16
Rick
So to me, it always starts with the fuel. What is and you know, in the in Johnson ten, that abundant life. It doesn’t have an end to it. Right. It’s just overflowing, you know? And ultimately, Jesus is the answer to that.
10;52;26;16 – 10;52;18;28
Rick
But from a standpoint of like spirituality and just divine design. There are things that you will gravitate.
10;52;18;28 – 10;52;14;22
Aaron
Towards and you just love and your preferences when you come to life and we might hate.
10;52;14;22 – 10;52;10;22
Aaron
It. You know, it’s like, why does that so life.
10;52;10;22 – 10;52;07;26
Aaron
Giving to you? Why is that? Why do you gravitate towards that?
10;52;07;26 – 10;52;06;17
Rick
And then there are other things like.
10;52;06;17 – 10;51;54;19
Aaron
I was listening to a podcast with Tim Ferriss where he was interviewing Michael Phelps and another an Aussie gold medalist. I can’t remember his name right now, but they were talking about their their regiment.
10;51;54;15 – 10;51;53;17
Rick
How they became.
10;51;53;17 – 10;51;52;19
Aaron
Olympic athletes.
10;51;52;01 – 10;51;49;00
Rick
And when they described what they did every.
10;51;48;29 – 10;51;41;20
Aaron
Day for five to seven years in eight to 10,000 calories that need and how much they worked out and how they did their sleep. And I didn’t.
10;51;41;02 – 10;51;37;14
Rick
You know, that was a regiment that they loved.
10;51;37;08 – 10;51;35;29
Aaron
The process of.
10;51;35;19 – 10;51;34;29
Rick
And they love.
10;51;34;29 – 10;51;34;02
Aaron
The fruits of.
10;51;34;02 – 10;51;29;19
Rick
The gold medals, but the discipline where the train tracks for them.
10;51;29;18 – 10;51;28;08
Aaron
To accomplish it. Mm-Hmm.
10;51;27;15 – 10;51;23;16
Rick
But they had a shadow side to it as well, and they go on and I.
10;51;23;16 – 10;51;17;23
Aaron
Think it’s a great podcast is they’re very authentic with mental health in the shadow side of what they engage.
10;51;17;15 – 10;51;14;23
Rick
With. But they really the question.
10;51;14;23 – 10;51;13;02
Aaron
Was what would you tell your younger self?
10;51;12;02 – 10;51;06;02
Rick
And it was a lot about, do this because I love the journey, but do it in addition to living our.
10;51;06;02 – 10;51;02;18
Aaron
Values because I’m living out of things that are most important.
10;51;02;18 – 10;51;02;09
Aaron
To me.
10;51;01;01 – 10;50;46;08
Jon
What I love is we’re talking about prioritization, and I think it comes back to what you keep saying. The value based living right like what the need to start with that. Does this provide? Wife, right, does this make me feel more alive and vibrant and rejuvenated?
10;50;46;00 – 10;50;28;05
Jon
Or not? Yeah, it was because for the most part, you’re already challenging your already being counterculture in your conversations, already challenging the assumed norm of just grind it out. Right. So what? You have to start there to reset the mind to look, this is bring positive things into my life, making me more productive or destroying me within
10;50;28;02 – 10;50;04;05
Jon
it. I love how it always comes full circle to consistency and discipline, because the things that are good for you or that produce a good return on investment are often costly and can be draining. Right, right. I didn’t want to do my workout this morning and no desire, but I did it because I knew that the cost
10;50;04;05 – 10;49;52;00
Jon
of not doing it on my psyche into it and who I want to become in mentally would be worse than if I did. Right. So there’s that return investment, the discipline, deferred event discipline. That’s the goal.
10;49;51;23 – 10;49;49;19
Aaron
Because you’ve identified the value and the value.
10;49;49;11 – 10;49;34;18
Jon
Is being disciplined and consistent in the pursuit of something of a higher value. So it’s like, well, I’m going to say no to the comfort of now not wanting to do it in pursuit of wanting a higher valued existence.
10;49;34;07 – 10;49;17;25
Jon
And this becomes really less even about the act, less even about the workout, more it’s about the act of discipline inaccuracy. But that has to come when you’re resetting your mind after you’ve taken a step back excuse to begin to pursue the life giving stuff.
10;49;17;09 – 10;49;15;20
Rick
Yeah, I think it’s good, and I think.
10;49;15;20 – 10;49;06;23
Aaron
It’s worthy of talking about the shadow side of things. And when we wake up and we’re discouraged and we don’t want to move on or we don’t want to work out.
10;49;06;18 – 10;49;02;22
Rick
And maybe we’re questioning, is.
10;49;02;22 – 10;48;58;26
Aaron
This going to work? You know, is this worth it or.
10;48;58;12 – 10;48;56;18
Rick
Whatever kind of things.
10;48;56;18 – 10;48;54;22
Aaron
That go down in your thought process?
10;48;54;02 – 10;48;49;12
Rick
And I call those managers and I call it like, Man, I need some.
10;48;49;12 – 10;48;41;22
Aaron
Man to do. I need some room where I’m remembering some reminders of why I’m doing what I’m doing.
10;48;41;16 – 10;48;38;15
Rick
And I’ve personally created.
10;48;38;15 – 10;48;35;03
Aaron
two tools that help me recalibrate a.
10;48;35;03 – 10;48;31;15
Rick
Little bit emotionally. one of them is it’s just.
10;48;31;00 – 10;48;25;16
Aaron
It’s just quotes, encouraging words, scriptures of.
10;48;25;15 – 10;48;25;01
Rick
Things.
10;48;25;01 – 10;48;16;15
Aaron
Reminders of my values and why I’m doing it. And so reading through those receptors, my emotions.
10;48;15;21 – 10;48;14;11
Rick
And it reminds.
10;48;14;11 – 10;47;57;15
Aaron
Me, Oh yeah, that’s true. And yeah, I really do want to see that happen. That’s why I ask you guys about the vision. You know what? What’s worth, getting up, what’s worth the pain, what’s worth the suffering? There’s a picture that I see that doesn’t exist yet and is only valuable, and I’m going to effort to make
10;47;57;15 – 10;47;57;00
Aaron
it happen.
10;47;56;01 – 10;47;54;03
Rick
The other tool is this kind of a.
10;47;54;03 – 10;47;45;00
Aaron
Reminder of all the different ways in my context of how God has gone before me and moved on my behalf. And I have the dates and the events.
10;47;44;17 – 10;47;42;22
Rick
And it just reminds you that you’re not alone.
10;47;42;16 – 10;47;40;24
Aaron
That you’re on a journey of purpose.
10;47;39;10 – 10;47;37;05
Rick
And I think in the in our day and time.
10;47;37;05 – 10;47;22;19
Aaron
We’re going through COVID and still in it and how it exacerbates marriages and homes, individuals and leaders on there, maybe not having a great, solid foundation.
10;47;21;12 – 10;47;19;16
Rick
A lot of the battle is in our minds.
10;47;18;28 – 10;47;11;03
Aaron
While the battle is at our heart and some of it is just emotions. Sometimes it’s just a fog. one of.
10;47;11;03 – 10;47;10;05
Rick
The things what miners have.
10;47;10;05 – 10;47;04;25
Aaron
Good reasons why this is happening, but you know, some of these things are out of our control.
10;47;04;11 – 10;46;59;21
Aaron
So the two recalibration issues are encouragement.
10;46;59;10 – 10;46;56;10
Rick
Mm-Hmm. So I call it my life coaches and.
10;46;56;10 – 10;46;54;03
Aaron
Encouraging words and six quotes and.
10;46;53;29 – 10;46;53;24
Rick
In.
10;46;53;23 – 10;46;51;27
Aaron
Scriptures and and.
10;46;50;18 – 10;46;50;05
Rick
Just these.
10;46;50;04 – 10;46;36;10
Aaron
Inspirational thoughts that are really like help me get back on track. And then the other one is a reminder of how I’ve done here, different ways that have been that in my case, got his move or no for us to confirm we’re on this path.
10;46;35;28 – 10;46;33;27
Rick
And so it was kind of like a.
10;46;32;24 – 10;46;30;10
Aaron
You know, a hall of remembrance, if you will.
10;46;30;06 – 10;46;29;16
Rick
But then also.
10;46;29;16 – 10;46;27;19
Aaron
The feeling of encouragement of like.
10;46;27;18 – 10;46;26;19
Rick
You’re doing something.
10;46;26;19 – 10;46;25;11
Aaron
That’s worthwhile.
10;46;24;15 – 10;46;23;02
Rick
You just don’t feel like it today.
10;46;22;28 – 10;46;21;08
Aaron
Or you don’t feel like doing it today.
10;46;20;22 – 10;46;19;03
Rick
And it’s like getting once again.
10;46;19;02 – 10;46;16;23
Aaron
Attaching it back to the value. And the purpose.
10;46;16;04 – 10;46;15;01
Rick
Is a really it doesn’t have.
10;46;14;23 – 10;46;13;03
Aaron
A purpose. I’m probably have to give up.
10;46;12;19 – 10;46;00;15
Aaron
Mm-Hmm. I had that when I first had a salary job. My boss at the time wisely gave me this advice, he said. He said Every time you get encouraging now, it’s something that is meaningful to you at the moment to save it.
10;46;00;11 – 10;45;47;12
Aaron
And he had a file. This is the encouragement that you’re going to need it at some point because you’re going to want to quit your job like a dozen. Yeah, it’s hard. It gets hard, but it’s worth it, right?
10;45;47;08 – 10;45;44;16
Aaron
I need to go back and go, OK, this is why I’m still doing.
10;45;43;22 – 10;45;23;28
Jon
I have screenshots in a box and it’s similar to my mindset. Mentors, men. I’ve served with people who work with things like that, but some reason it’s interesting. I actually read three things that you do when you feel discouraged and you’re kind of questioning that or looking for a refreshment to stay the course, right?
10;45;23;13 – 10;45;11;26
Jon
It’s like I of the framework. You know, your dream. You know, you’re discouraged the three things that you do, or you try to remember the why like, why am I on this pursuit, right? When what is the vision?
10;45;11;11 – 10;44;57;07
Jon
What is the goal that motivated me to start this in the first place? And then with that in mind, revisit some encouragement, right? Whether it’s, you know, quotes, whether it’s words, encouragement, you say from partners, what have you?
10;44;56;24 – 10;44;44;11
Jon
And then the third one is remember victories, right? Because this isn’t it’s unlikely. This is the first difficult thing that you cannot overcome. If it is, then get past it and remember it.
10;44;43;15 – 10;44;39;17
Aaron
There’s a long way. Yeah, but if you’re looking for. Yeah.
10;44;39;08 – 10;44;20;21
Jon
If you survived that conflict already, you it’s pretty. Remember beating it. And you talked about that. OK, I’m going to remember why I’m doing this. If I’m going to remember the last conflict I had that I overcame in the pursuit of this and maybe the one before that, maybe long before that, we knew how beat up I
10;44;20;21 – 10;44;08;08
Jon
feel. And then I was going to top off that little motivation pill with looking at some encouragement, some some kind words, some things that really blew me away that I or that I need to hear, right? Because like, when we’re hungry, we eat.
10;44;08;01 – 10;44;04;13
Jon
Yeah. So if you’re discouraged, consume encouraging.
10;44;03;15 – 10;44;02;26
Aaron
Very logical.
10;44;02;26 – 10;43;59;17
Jon
But those are the three things I heard. And I think that.
10;43;59;17 – 10;43;38;05
Aaron
It’s not foreign to anybody at the highest level names. We all know that I’ve done incredible things could tell you, they’ll say. In fact, I was in this incredible little podcast about the these ten top leaders, and they were asked their top five motivators and their top five most influential pieces with becoming who they are.
10;43;37;26 – 10;43;32;12
Aaron
And at least three or four of them were major failures or times really had to get through difficulty.
10;43;31;25 – 10;43;28;10
Jon
Or failure to find more than cover to write, you know.
10;43;28;00 – 10;43;13;29
Aaron
Yeah, it’s it was there. Not not quitting, but failing. There’s the difference. Right. So just realizing they came to the rehearsals and now they have to calibrate differently and it changes the next thing going forward. But they didn’t.
10;43;13;21 – 10;43;12;02
Aaron
Yeah, I can’t walk.
10;43;12;02 – 10;43;11;05
Aaron
Away. I agree.
10;43;11;05 – 10;43;09;27
Rick
With. And I think that.
10;43;08;15 – 10;43;07;26
Aaron
We.
10;43;07;10 – 10;43;05;29
Rick
We misunderstand.
10;43;05;29 – 10;43;03;08
Aaron
How powerful discouragement is. Mm hmm.
10;43;03;01 – 10;42;58;23
Rick
So when I was on the other side of that burnout.
10;42;58;23 – 10;42;53;22
Aaron
Experience, I shared with you that there was a belief in me that my best days were behind me.
10;42;52;13 – 10;42;50;29
Rick
And that and I literally felt.
10;42;50;29 – 10;42;49;06
Aaron
That I felt defeated in our thought.
10;42;48;23 – 10;42;45;23
Rick
Well, this is and I had a friends in.
10;42;45;23 – 10;42;34;03
Aaron
one of our life group meetings when I was sharing that, and he’s like, Do you believe that that thought is from God? And I thought. No, he wouldn’t say that.
10;42;33;08 – 10;42;32;13
Rick
And then it clicked, why.
10;42;32;13 – 10;42;31;14
Aaron
Am I thinking that?
10;42;31;00 – 10;42;28;16
Aaron
Yeah, I got what a good friend. That’s it. Yeah.
10;42;28;05 – 10;42;27;06
Rick
A good friend would say that.
10;42;26;25 – 10;42;24;18
Aaron
You know, it’s not good. It’s not.
10;42;24;16 – 10;42;12;09
Jon
Is. This is the thought. And you see this with a lot of people. Yeah. If your best days are behind you, then why continue it? Right? Like, there’s this, and I think we brought this up in an earlier conversation.
10;42;12;09 – 10;41;54;12
Jon
But there’s this lady. I heard this reading actually twelve rules for, like the Jordan Peterson was one of the examples that he wrote. He shared. But there is this lady at a cocktail party and there’s a psychiatrist or psychologist there, something she’s talkative and kind of explaining what’s wrong with her getting some free counseling right at this
10;41;54;12 – 10;41;39;14
Jon
point? And she she kind of just goes, OK, what’s wrong with me? And it took the gentleman party off guard, right? What do you mean? What’s wrong with you? You want something wrong with you? And she said, absolutely, because if something’s wrong with me, I can work to fix it.
10;41;39;03 – 10;41;23;13
Jon
I can work to change it. If nothing’s wrong with me, this is the world, then I might as well put myself in. And to me, there’s a bottom line. There are things that are good and there are things that are not good or bad, and it’s good to be able to differentiate between the two, you know, which
10;41;23;13 – 10;41;07;18
Jon
is which. So if you are entertaining the lie or the thought that my best days are behind me, that is not good and that is bad, that will only lead you to not living may maybe existing, but not living.
10;41;06;25 – 10;40;52;27
Jon
So what is good that you can pull from that? Well, I don’t know how to fix that. It may be true. It may be hard, but I’m going to begin working to find what a better day might look like and how I might be able to take the first step to it.
10;40;52;27 – 10;40;50;04
Jon
And then I’m going to and take that step. Yeah. You know.
10;40;50;04 – 10;40;48;24
Rick
If you’re in that state of.
10;40;48;24 – 10;40;48;10
Aaron
Mind.
10;40;46;02 – 10;40;44;02
Rick
We affectionately call that the of suck.
10;40;43;23 – 10;40;42;12
Aaron
Yes, that is.
10;40;41;23 – 10;40;38;27
Aaron
It isn’t right. It pretty hard to say.
10;40;38;05 – 10;40;36;23
Rick
But sometimes you need someone else.
10;40;36;23 – 10;40;36;03
Aaron
To remind you.
10;40;35;25 – 10;40;35;15
Aaron
Mm-Hmm.
10;40;35;13 – 10;40;31;29
Rick
Yeah. And for whatever reason, in that stage of life, I didn’t.
10;40;31;29 – 10;40;19;29
Aaron
Have the capacity or wasn’t getting there on my own. But after truth was spoken into me, I was like, Well, my best days are ahead of me, and I think you’re right. This is not a truth, which is a lie believing in it.
10;40;19;07 – 10;40;17;17
Rick
And that, to me, is a motivating.
10;40;17;17 – 10;40;08;29
Aaron
Factor to come alongside leaders, as if you’re in a place where you feel like your best days are behind you. That’s human. That’s okay. It’s just not true.
10;40;08;13 – 10;40;02;05
Rick
And there are a lot of things that can change or maybe need to change to help get back up out of the valley and.
10;40;01;24 – 10;40;01;00
Aaron
On the mountain peaks.
10;40;01;00 – 10;39;57;08
Rick
But just staying there and recognizing.
10;39;57;08 – 10;39;53;15
Aaron
That that’s the case is to be stopped or something needs to change.
10;39;53;12 – 10;39;34;02
Jon
Yeah, that just true with that one. Just a quick shout out to the importance of choosing leaders surrounding yourself with to the best of your ability, right when you’re crafting and investing your inner circle. It really pays to do it with journaling or, you know, whatever your situation with friends or people who are going to be watching
10;39;34;02 – 10;39;23;24
Jon
, you speak what’s good to you when you need it right and be able to jump into the valley with you and say, Well, I guess I can hear, yeah, but I’m going to sit with you for a bit, but then we’re going to start moving.
10;39;23;08 – 10;39;13;26
Jon
I’m tired. That’s fine. You’re so moving, right? So that’s kind of one aspect of it, which is really great. You know, it’s just pushing through.
10;39;13;12 – 10;39;02;18
Aaron
Is what a valuable time to have at the moment. You know, you’re right, and this is a voice that was not know it was. And it was really making what we call it, making the storm longer than it needs to be.
10;39;02;18 – 10;39;02;03
Rick
That’s right.
10;39;02;01 – 10;39;00;27
Aaron
And perpetuating.
10;39;00;14 – 10;38;59;26
Aaron
The thoughts.
10;38;59;26 – 10;38;58;06
Rick
That almost in.
10;38;58;06 – 10;38;51;22
Aaron
A self protecting self-healing self, everything was self.
10;38;50;11 – 10;38;37;00
Jon
To that point, I forgot the second point. Thank you because you both just jogged it again. But the Senate? Yes, there’s this weird quasi ownership, especially when you know you’re about to intrude on sometimes circumstance. I’m about to about a storm.
10;38;36;28 – 10;38;21;16
Jon
Yeah, right. I’m coming on this storm. There’s this weird adverse ownership look like I’m going to be depressed. I’m going to be hurting. I’m going to be these things. And when I hear that I hate it, I hate it with everything in me because I’m like, Okay, here’s a novel idea, right?
10;38;21;08 – 10;38;09;16
Jon
If you’re about to get punched in the face, it’s going to hurt. Let’s instead of thinking about how much it’s going to hurt, I’m going to be hurting my eyes, going to bruise up and it may swell and I want to shift our perspective too.
10;38;09;05 – 10;37;59;14
Jon
I’m going to be punched in the face and I’m going to do this to keep you right. Whatever small thing it is like, it’s fair when you’re going to go through hell that it’s going to suck. No one’s saying about this.
10;37;59;10 – 10;37;42;17
Jon
It’s not going to sit right. But instead of only inflaming that, I’m going to be depressed, right? Why don’t we instead say, OK, this is going to be very hard? I can tell him about to challenge. I can tell it’s about to put me in a conflict on areas that I could be stronger.
10;37;41;09 – 10;37;23;00
Jon
I’m going to start owning the weight through it instead of owning the death of it. You know, I’m not going to own the depression. I’m going to own the pursuit of health through the depression beyond it. Right now, I’m going to set my target on the other.
10;37;22;01 – 10;37;10;12
Jon
On the other side of this dark time. Right? Because if I know I’m going experience, I have a self-awareness and I’m going to that. There is no point in owning it and making it my own. And then because that’s going to perpetuate the pain.
10;37;10;03 – 10;36;59;01
Jon
You might as well begin to dial in on to the things that will help shorten that time while still allowing me to learn what needs to be learned in that time to get through it and then apply it.
10;36;58;21 – 10;36;44;20
Aaron
I think it’s wonderful, especially if you’ve been through adversity or have those skill sets. And I think if you’re at a place where you don’t know where to turn, then it’s like your step one is to ask for help.
10;36;44;03 – 10;36;38;20
Aaron
It really is. So if you don’t know how to navigate or you’re fearful or overwhelmed by.
10;36;38;20 – 10;36;35;21
Rick
It, then that’s okay to like. Ideally, I’d like.
10;36;35;21 – 10;36;30;05
Aaron
To say, Oh, here’s another storm. I know what to do in the storm closed the windows in the back of the hatches.
10;36;29;11 – 10;36;27;06
Rick
But you know, some.
10;36;27;05 – 10;36;18;00
Aaron
Some people are at a place of in survival mode where you or your defense posture is fight or flight or fright.
10;36;17;22 – 10;36;17;11
Aaron
Mm-Hmm.
10;36;17;02 – 10;36;16;11
Rick
And in that.
10;36;16;11 – 10;36;06;08
Aaron
Case, if you’re in the flight standpoint, you’re going to basically curl in a ball or feel debilitated in a sense. And you know.
10;36;04;02 – 10;36;00;21
Rick
That’s where someone realizing your self-awareness.
10;36;00;21 – 10;35;56;13
Aaron
Is, this is how I function. And I need someone to help me get out of the valley.
10;35;55;02 – 10;35;37;08
Jon
And it’s just that’s really what I think. It’s really good balance, right? Because here he says, OK, yeah, you’re right. I am speaking very authoritatively. This is how you can push through that with the compassion side. And the realism is you may not have those quick clippings.
10;35;37;03 – 10;35;22;15
Jon
You don’t know how that skillset and what I love you define what that what the first step towards that skillset is. It’s not going to this is going to be depressing, right? This is going to break me. I’m going to own the fact that I need help and I’m going to pursue that help.
10;35;21;26 – 10;35;06;09
Jon
So in the same way, you’re doing the same thing, just wine. We need to start if you don’t know how to do that, and it probably is rare that you would do that on your own anyways, even when you know, like any and practically if you’re going to bring in my buddies, right?
10;35;06;08 – 10;34;57;08
Jon
I mean, in these things. It’s like I’m just an ass for help from someone who I think might know. Yeah, you know, and maybe that’s the only thing I can say to do, like, Hey, I need to surround myself with people.
10;34;57;01 – 10;34;50;11
Jon
Yeah, trying to do so. I just thought there’s a wonderful correction, added added layer of perspective.
10;34;50;10 – 10;34;45;07
Rick
And I think if you’re a fighter, they’re like, Let’s go, let’s go time. You know, you’re going to. And if you’re a.
10;34;45;07 – 10;34;44;05
Aaron
Flight or.
10;34;44;00 – 10;34;40;25
Aaron
Yeah, I feel like I’m out of your ticket or they thing, what has.
10;34;40;07 – 10;34;37;11
Jon
Happened that you’re right? Yeah, for example, like.
10;34;37;08 – 10;34;35;25
Aaron
I think you’re just paralyzing.
10;34;35;25 – 10;34;34;17
Jon
Fear, you know?
10;34;34;11 – 10;34;33;11
Aaron
You know, you just stop.
10;34;32;29 – 10;34;19;09
Aaron
While you go. So if you’re this is as we wrap here, I’m just thinking about like, this is the power of a coach, right? Because if you have something you know that you have to do like this is identified, I must win in this area.
10;34;18;27 – 10;34;04;06
Aaron
But I’m just not strong enough to do it or I know it. And sometimes the strength is I’m in my own way. Like, I know I’ll get to a certain point. I’m taking over because I’m just I’m limited in that moment, just grit through it like I should.
10;34;03;23 – 10;33;52;21
Aaron
But if I had somebody next to me, you know, yelling at me as it were, you know, and as we’re pushing me up that hill a little bit, then OK, fine. Then I’ve identified that’s what’s going to help me to get up there.
10;33;52;16 – 10;33;41;01
Aaron
Yeah, it’s the power of a coach. Like, it just pushes you so much further. You have it in you. Absolutely. Very likely you have it. So you just need someone to temper the way. Yeah.
10;33;40;18 – 10;33;24;20
Jon
Yeah, it’s like the three things to seek out, right? So when you’re going through the fight with you from their own perspective, right, you can have wonderful encouragement from that mentor level. And it’s, you know, it’s really, really does to bring in.
10;33;24;20 – 10;33;08;02
Jon
And it’s interesting because one of the men I had a gentleman who was in his seventies and his mentor of mine for years and cherish him. And he had a mental reason to sign it. And it’s interesting because it’s like it’s it’s easy regardless of the stage, Fletcher, if you have the ability to have a mentor.
10;33;07;24 – 10;33;05;05
Jon
It is. So it’s an old school relationship.
10;33;05;05 – 10;33;03;09
Aaron
So much.
10;33;02;15 – 10;33;01;14
Rick
Yeah. And I like to think of it.
10;33;01;14 – 10;32;55;25
Aaron
As a guy because, you know, like here’s some like playbooks or ideas or.
10;32;54;27 – 10;32;50;09
Rick
Or maybe some new skill sets that you gain, but you’re right, you have it in here.
10;32;49;08 – 10;32;41;27
Aaron
Especially if you’re a leader and still in leadership, which has hit some things, we get stuck or we need help with and we all are there.
10;32;40;13 – 10;32;32;24
Rick
But you know, there have been are specialized guys. You know, if you want to bulk up and compete in a Mr. Universe.
10;32;32;24 – 10;32;25;24
Aaron
Or whatever, then you probably know someone who knows nutrition, you know, and weightlifting and all that kind of stuff that comes with it.
10;32;25;06 – 10;32;24;01
Rick
That would be a that would be.
10;32;24;01 – 10;32;20;14
Aaron
Smart to hire someone to help you get there on your own.
10;32;20;14 – 10;32;17;09
Rick
But if you’re if you’re a leader, we’re going to try.
10;32;17;07 – 10;32;06;18
Aaron
Those things on our own, you know, especially if you’re an entrepreneur, because that’s kind of the reason why you’re doing it. It’s like, I want to see if I can do this. I want to experience the freedom benefits.
10;32;05;11 – 10;32;04;17
Rick
And then you will.
10;32;04;10 – 10;31;50;07
Aaron
You will experience success. But then you also experience that resistance. And it’s like, how do we think differently or utilize new tools to get to a different place? But I would hate for you to be experienced so much success that it’s overwhelming.
10;31;50;07 – 10;31;41;09
Aaron
And then you’re bankrupt in your heart and in your personal life because you can’t sustain that pressure, you’re going through human existence.
10;31;41;07 – 10;31;40;20
Rick
It seems.
10;31;40;20 – 10;31;36;11
Aaron
Like it’s inevitable that some of these flames out somewhere along the way, and I still.
10;31;36;11 – 10;31;35;15
Rick
Is. I mean that you.
10;31;35;06 – 10;31;32;01
Aaron
Won’t ever experience hardships or health or whatever.
10;31;30;23 – 10;31;30;08
Rick
But I just.
10;31;30;08 – 10;31;18;26
Aaron
Think the there’s a lot of peace and there’s a lot of joy. There’s a lot of being present and enjoying today when you’re living in places that you truly enjoy. Mm-Hmm.
10;31;18;10 – 10;31;00;23
Aaron
Wow. That is terrible. I love what we talked about. The is a healthy conversation that you’re not really free shipping. I love that. I love that. We talked about addressing what our capacity is and and how much we have in our jar and what that looks like a love that we touch that what’s life giving and life
10;31;00;22 – 10;30;41;05
Aaron
taking a little bit of homework you have out there for? Maybe you do that with the spouse or even even yourself, right? Being honest, writing out, that was how we can get energy, identify with things we need to go do when we’re starting to get burnt out, managing our week or values facing the finite or the limitations
10;30;40;26 – 10;30;26;22
Aaron
of who we are and really going beyond survival is beyond survival coaching as that put a base bow on it. Yeah, that’s what you’re doing. We’re we’re getting, we’re understanding. Sometimes we are surviving, but there is a way to not live there.
10;30;26;19 – 10;30;20;16
Aaron
We’re trying to go beyond that. And that’s that’s how you’re that’s what you’re doing. Yeah. Now I love talking to you.
10;30;20;13 – 10;30;18;28
Aaron
Yes, it’s a blessing. So real.
10;30;18;28 – 10;30;11;22
Jon
Quick. Before we go, would you mind sharing a little bit more of a if if someone wants to learn more about your what you’re doing with your coaching and.
10;30;11;04 – 10;30;10;22
Aaron
Look to.
10;30;10;09 – 10;30;08;26
Jon
Leadership survival guiding?
10;30;08;12 – 10;30;07;26
Aaron
Yes.
10;30;07;13 – 10;30;06;07
Rick
Well, I mean, if.
10;30;06;01 – 10;29;59;02
Aaron
Before we’ve talked about resonated with a friend that you know or yourself and you’re like, Hey, I just want to help for a period of time.
10;29;57;17 – 10;29;55;10
Rick
I think I’ll give you the framework to.
10;29;55;10 – 10;29;43;15
Aaron
I think through that coaching is one. Are you in survival mode or are you in a stabilization mode or are you in strategy mode? Are you in strengthening or you and success thriving when.
10;29;42;16 – 10;29;41;22
Rick
We all get.
10;29;41;22 – 10;29;39;00
Aaron
Through those seasons one way or another?
10;29;38;01 – 10;29;37;19
Rick
If you’re in.
10;29;37;19 – 10;29;32;23
Aaron
Survival mode, you know you need the basics, you need to pressure off any food or water.
10;29;32;03 – 10;29;30;28
Rick
If you’re in a stabilizing.
10;29;30;28 – 10;29;25;23
Aaron
Mode means that you know the ship needs some securing so that.
10;29;25;23 – 10;29;23;02
Rick
When it’s not going to go under. My favorite a.
10;29;23;02 – 10;29;14;07
Aaron
Strategy because then we get to dream. Which is to say, when you talk about, you know, the question I asked at the beginning, what’s the vision, what I hope to see, what to do?
10;29;14;07 – 10;29;13;05
Rick
Will I be if I’m plucked.
10;29;13;05 – 10;29;01;19
Aaron
Out of here and planted somewhere else in a different state or what values? And then you start putting strength behind that and strengthening those vision, those values, that heartbeat.
10;29;01;00 – 10;29;00;08
Rick
And then I believe.
10;29;00;08 – 10;28;53;13
Aaron
Over time, we experience success and sometimes we have to evolve again and go through those stages.
10;28;53;05 – 10;28;52;13
Rick
Hopefully, all the way.
10;28;52;13 – 10;28;41;14
Aaron
Back down to survival. But things happen. You know, marriages don’t stay long term. The stock market can crash. There’s the.
10;28;41;13 – 10;28;37;14
Rick
Things that happen to have an effect on us that then, you know, take.
10;28;37;14 – 10;28;34;10
Aaron
Us out of our rhythm and we need help.
10;28;34;02 – 10;28;28;21
Rick
Getting it back. And then in the business side, it’s there. We go through those a lot.
10;28;28;21 – 10;28;27;08
Aaron
Of times, you know, feast or famine.
10;28;26;18 – 10;28;25;24
Aaron
I mean, when you have.
10;28;25;20 – 10;28;21;29
Rick
Those kind of things. And so it’s just being methodical and making.
10;28;21;29 – 10;28;16;24
Aaron
Sure I’m doing the things that are going to be most successful for my business or organization.
10;28;16;04 – 10;28;04;04
Aaron
Greg, thanks to you for doing what you’re doing. I love the conversation about really protecting our values and what it takes to bolster that movie and live that way. And so being really intentional. So thanks for that voice.
10;28;04;01 – 10;28;03;07
Aaron
Thanks for having me.
10;28;02;28 – 10;28;00;04
Jon
Yeah, thank you. What’s the best way for people to reach out?
10;27;59;17 – 10;27;58;18
Rick
They can go to.
10;27;58;18 – 10;27;51;03
Aaron
Beyond Survival dot org. As far as the website. Or you can email me at Rick at survival coaching.
